FFX-3 Chat

Final Fantasy X-3 => FFX-3 Speculation and Developments => Topic started by: ChercheurObscur on December 03, 2014, 03:35:33 am


Title: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 03, 2014, 03:35:33 am
I'm currently working on a full translation, with the help of CrystalOfLies and kk
The translation is available in a second topic set up by CrystalOfLies

State of progress
[...]
Chapter 32 : 2 / 2 pages
Chapter 33 : 12 / 12 pages
Final Chapter : 3 / 3 pages

--- 265 / 265 pages ---

VICTORY FANFARE !!!
-------------------------------------------------------

Information must only come from the french translation or a reliable source !

What can I expect from this topic ?

Everything ! You can ask any questions !
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on December 03, 2014, 09:10:21 am
Yay! :D

Well, let's see... here's a few I can think of off the top of my head!

1. Addressing rumors and complaints that reviewers had: Is Yuna cold to Tidus? Does she seem less in love with him than she was in X and X-2? Are the rest of his friends cold or unwelcoming to him?

2. More rumor clearing up: Is Tidus unusually sexual? Follow up question: Did they or did they not have sex on the boat? And is that why the boat crashed??? xD

3. How does Tidus die and how is he revived? I know we've cleared up how he died, now, but some more detail would be nice!

4. More explanation of Yuna losing her memories and how she got them back would be nice, too!

5. Wtf is going on with this Sex Fayth method stuff?! Is it real?? If it's not used by Yuna and Tidus in the book, why is it even mentioned at all? Did Ifarnal and Kushu even know each other before they had sex?? Because FFX made a big deal of 'you have to have a strong bond to create the Final Aeon'. Is sex itself, regardless of whether or not you actually KNOW the person, considered bond enough, haha? That's taking the 'bonding' part quite literally, isn't it? You don't have to actually have an emotional connection, just need to have... connected bodies. xD I'm just curious because this little tidbit about old summoning methods is interesting, but seems out of place in the generally rather PG Final Fantasy world.

6. What is the significance of the island, and the dead summoner(s?) who inhabit it? What relevance do they have to FFX/Tidus and Yuna/the plot of the novel/games? Basically, why is Nojima telling us their story, is what I want to know... o.o Surely there must be some kind of 'lesson' or significance to be had from their story, right?

7. Also, if you want to fill us in on what their story even IS, that'd be cool, too. xD

8. Ifarnal "had children as an unsent". Does it say (or hint at) who these children are? Was it/they conceived when Kushu and Ifarnal made the aeon, or is it Ifarnal's and someone else's? I'm curious as to whether the child was born 100% unsent or just half... or... is it some kind of special state of being because the Sex Fayth method... just wondering what it means to be a child of an unsent. o.o Also whatever happened to the child?!

9. "If either figure out, the process would be "undone"', in reference to Tidus' revival. So, at the end of the novel... what exactly do they and do they not remember? Do they remember the things on the island that happened before and AFTER the revival, just not the revival? Or do they not remember anything at all from the island? And does 'coming undone' mean Tidus would die again, or... what?

10. What is the overall feeling at the end of the novel? Are they happy, sad, hopeless, hopeful? I know you said the very end is the Perfect Ending, but what about before that? I'm just trying to get a feel for what the message/point of this novel is...

11. What connections does this have to the Audio Drama? It introduces beckoning, yes? Do you think any of the events in the novel foreshadow or explain the events of the Audio drama?

12. Oh, yeah! What ever happened to the Briah person?! Do they say? Are they on the island, too?

Also, thank you sooooooo much for doing this! Seriously! Even if it turns out I don't like the details, it will give me so much comfort to finally have them. As a huge fan of the game, it's been so terrible being in the dark about all this stuff.

And for the record if anyone ever hears of or wants to embark on a project for the effort of a full translation into English, I'd do my best to offer donations and such!! I've seen a few projects like that for other novels/Ultimanias etc. on forums, so apparently, that's a thing that people do, right? :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: pierpaolo on December 03, 2014, 01:55:12 pm
Merci ChercheurObscour! Vive la france from an Italian fan  :)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 03, 2014, 01:55:38 pm
I will update this post as soon as I can, in order to answer all your questions (Thereafter, I will provide a file with all the answers in the first post) :

1. Addressing rumors and complaints that reviewers had: Is Yuna cold to Tidus? Does she seem less in love with him than she was in X and X-2? Are the rest of his friends cold or unwelcoming to him?

Yuna is not cold to Tidus, it's just she thinks about what she must do in the future (Working for Yevon or not ? etc.). Tidus is a little hard with her about this, so it does not help to defuse the situation. But his friends are very affectionate with him, his mind is just a bit dark and thereafter he becomes angry. Wakka is gentle, Rikku is gentle (but she has an argue with him), etc.

2. More rumor clearing up: Is Tidus unusually sexual? Follow up question: Did they or did they not have sex on the boat? And is that why the boat crashed??? xD

Tidus is a bit... flirtatious. Well he's a man. But he doesn't think "I want to do her !". He just want some good time with her : for example, they kiss, this kind of things.

I can't say if they have sex on the boat, there is an ellipsis. But that's not why the boat crashes. The boat crashes because of the violent sea, but... it seems the cause was a bomb in fact... because Tidus smells gunpowder at this moment. I don't know more about this.

3. How does Tidus die and how is he revived? I know we've cleared up how he died, now, but some more detail would be nice!

Tidus dies because of the ball which hits him on the back (as said in the previous topic, the translation is correct). This ball is a bomb from Zanarkand (see also the rundown "1000 years ago"). About his revival, Yuna gathers his pyroflies thanks to her powerful will. It's named "beckoning" in the previous topic. Tidus becomes an "incarnate spirit". Thereafter, Yuna is woken up by Tidus. I don't have more to say.

Just so you know, I think Tidus was murdered and I will explain why later (too long, too complex).

4. More explanation of Yuna losing her memories and how she got them back would be nice, too!

Read "Ifarnal / Yuna 1st conversation". Then, you need to know that Tidus and Yuna meet Kushu (as an aeon) soon after but their conversation becomes "weird" (it is very difficult to explain, I plan to translate this moment) and Yuna discovers that Tidus is an incarnate spirit.

5. Wtf is going on with this Sex Fayth method stuff?! Is it real?? If it's not used by Yuna and Tidus in the book, why is it even mentioned at all? Did Ifarnal and Kushu even know each other before they had sex?? Because FFX made a big deal of 'you have to have a strong bond to create the Final Aeon'. Is sex itself, regardless of whether or not you actually KNOW the person, considered bond enough, haha? That's taking the 'bonding' part quite literally, isn't it? You don't have to actually have an emotional connection, just need to have... connected bodies. xD I'm just curious because this little tidbit about old summoning methods is interesting, but seems out of place in the generally rather PG Final Fantasy world.

I need your attention here : Kushu is found half naked in Ifarnal's room, but nothing allows me to confirm a sex scene ! Ifarnal's fayth method could only be some... "foreplay". This point is very difficult to elucidate ! When Ifarnal hands down this knowledge to Yuna('s mind), she blushes. But she is not outraged. So maybe it is really just "foreplay".

6. What is the significance of the island, and the dead summoner(s?) who inhabit it? What relevance do they have to FFX/Tidus and Yuna/the plot of the novel/games? Basically, why is Nojima telling us their story, is what I want to know... o.o Surely there must be some kind of 'lesson' or significance to be had from their story, right?

The island is a summoning from Ifarnal ! It's about the Besaid from 1000 ago ! If you want to know more about this island and the connexion with Ifarnal, read the rundown "1000 years ago". Ifarnal uses a lot of fayths to make it appear.

Ifarnal wants to send Kushu into the farplane, because Kushu's body remains in Besaid Island (the real one, not the summoning), but he doesn't know  where her body is exactly. So... Tidus and Yuna' arrival is a good opportuny... (It will merge with what I said before about Tidus being possibly murdered)

7. Also, if you want to fill us in on what their story even IS, that'd be cool, too. xD

I will provide a file with details about the global story. Just let me some time  :P

8. Ifarnal "had children as an unsent". Does it say (or hint at) who these children are? Was it/they conceived when Kushu and Ifarnal made the aeon, or is it Ifarnal's and someone else's? I'm curious as to whether the child was born 100% unsent or just half... or... is it some kind of special state of being because the Sex Fayth method... just wondering what it means to be a child of an unsent. o.o Also whatever happened to the child?!

TUTUTUTUTU FALSE INFORMATION DETECTED !  :P

Ifarnal did'nt have children. But Briah had ! In fact, He had one daughter named Luchera. But her name was changed to Mohra because under pressure from... Bevelle. It is a bit strange when you know people from Bevelle's side took names from divinities like this "Luchera" (Kushu, Ifarnal, etc.). Briah's wife is named Meroh, someone normal. So no sex-method. Unfortunately she died from torture. The culprit is... Bevelle. Bevelle wanted to know how she knew about "Anli's eye", a star. Because Anli is a divinity too, like Luchera. So it seems Bevelle has some shame about its past... At the end, Mohra died of old age.

9. "If either figure out, the process would be "undone"', in reference to Tidus' revival. So, at the end of the novel... what exactly do they and do they not remember? Do they remember the things on the island that happened before and AFTER the revival, just not the revival? Or do they not remember anything at all from the island? And does 'coming undone' mean Tidus would die again, or... what?

They remember everything about the island. Only the death's moment remains unknown to Tidus (Yuna remembers it).

'coming undone'... Well even for me it is difficult to find an answer for now  :-\

10. What is the overall feeling at the end of the novel? Are they happy, sad, hopeless, hopeful? I know you said the very end is the Perfect Ending, but what about before that? I'm just trying to get a feel for what the message/point of this novel is...

At the very end of the novel, Tidus seems to be enthusiastic, he wonders about his condition but seems happy. Yuna detaches herself a bit, she is very worried about Tidus and his state (incarnate spirit).

Before this ending, Tidus and Yuna witness Briah and Kushu's meeting. It is very beautiful but very strange and very sad too. Tidus tries to prevent Briah from going (into the farplane I suppose). Yuna barely speak. It is better to read this moment in order to understand it well. Kushu leaves (with Bria I suppose too) at the end.

11. What connections does this have to the Audio Drama? It introduces beckoning, yes? Do you think any of the events in the novel foreshadow or explain the events of the Audio drama?

Yes, it introduces beckoning. It explains why Tidus seems weak. About the return of Sin... I wonder who wished for this.

12. Oh, yeah! What ever happened to the Briah person?! Do they say? Are they on the island, too?

As you know, Briah is in fact Valm. So read the rundown "1000 years ago" to know about his past. Briah's memories were constantly erased by Ifarnal each time he was on Besaid or each time he remembered Kushu. But his memories come back when he meet the Al Bheds (Rikku, Shinra, etc.)
After some events, he meets Ifarnal and fight him. Thereafter, Ifarnal dies of a bomb (like the one for Tidus). To know what happened next, read the answer to the question 10.

Also, thank you sooooooo much for doing this! Seriously! Even if it turns out I don't like the details, it will give me so much comfort to finally have them. As a huge fan of the game, it's been so terrible being in the dark about all this stuff.

You're welcome ! ;)

And for the record if anyone ever hears of or wants to embark on a project for the effort of a full translation into English, I'd do my best to offer donations and such!! I've seen a few projects like that for other novels/Ultimanias etc. on forums, so apparently, that's a thing that people do, right? :P

If I was good with english, I would have translate the novel (for free), but unfortunately I am not :(
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on December 03, 2014, 01:58:34 pm
Thank you so much for doing this.

Ah... so Al Bhed is the corrupted more modern term for 'Alb's Bedohls'? And their power was the cause of the Machina War? How interesting. If you don't mind, I can fix up some of these translations to make them easier to read and post them here.

By golly, you did it. I don't hate the novel nearly as much now. Sure it has some flaws, but everything including the characters is a lot more understandable now, and there is a lot of potential for a sequel barring the disappointing re-summoning of Sin.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 03, 2014, 02:24:09 pm
Ah... so Al Bhed is the corrupted more modern term for 'Alb's Bedohls'? And their power was the cause of the Machina War? How interesting. If you don't mind, I can fix up some of these translations to make them easier to read and post them here.

I glady accept your offer ! You can provide me the correction in PM. ;) (of course I will write your name in the first post as a courtesy)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 03, 2014, 03:25:13 pm
That's why I wanted you to give me the correction in a file  :P It takes too much place in the topic  :-X Can you give your files ? I will insert them in the first post (with your name)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on December 03, 2014, 03:28:58 pm
Ah, okay. I'll delete the original post and send you it in the PM. You'll just have to copy and paste the whole thing.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 03, 2014, 04:07:53 pm
Fiouu, a bit hard to do a good OP  ;D Is it ok CrystalOfLies ?  :D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on December 03, 2014, 04:50:12 pm
Ooooh, looking forward to more info! The stuff we have so far is very enlightening! :D

So, what is it that Tidus needs to save Yuna from??? Or will that be explained later? o:

Also, just to confirm: Tidus and Yuna still DON'T have any memory of his revival, right? So... what do they think happened on the island? Or do they remember everything else that happened, just not his death and his revival? If Tidus changed, then, after his second revival... wouldn't Yuna have noticed? O.o


Well... I can say that I guess I'm glad there was no X-3 because with all of this information, combined with the audio drama... I'm fairly certain that Yuna or Tidus would recover her memories and he'd thus be killed off... again. For a third time. xD
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on December 04, 2014, 10:37:34 am
By the way Cher, I can help translate the whole novel into English. You can provide me with your English translation and I'll fix it up to make it easier to read. I've written fanfiction in the past and still do, so I know what I'm doing. :P

I could post it in a separate thread and give you some massive credit: if it weren't for you we might never have found out about all of this.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 04, 2014, 01:16:38 pm
Ooooh, looking forward to more info! The stuff we have so far is very enlightening! :D

So, what is it that Tidus needs to save Yuna from??? Or will that be explained later? o:

Also, just to confirm: Tidus and Yuna still DON'T have any memory of his revival, right? So... what do they think happened on the island? Or do they remember everything else that happened, just not his death and his revival? If Tidus changed, then, after his second revival... wouldn't Yuna have noticed? O.o


Well... I can say that I guess I'm glad there was no X-3 because with all of this information, combined with the audio drama... I'm fairly certain that Yuna or Tidus would recover her memories and he'd thus be killed off... again. For a third time. xD

Oh Tidus just wants to send her back to Besaid.

About the revival, Tidus doesn't know anything about this. But Yuna does. I explained some things in my previous post.

By the way Cher, I can help translate the whole novel into English. You can provide me with your English translation and I'll fix it up to make it easier to read. I've written fanfiction in the past and still do, so I know what I'm doing. :P

I could post it in a separate thread and give you some massive credit: if it weren't for you we might never have found out about all of this.

Huumm... Ok, let's do it ! ;P

But you'll have to be patient. I will give you the translation by chapter. I would like to have a way to talk to you other that this forum too.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Internal Medicine Doctor on December 06, 2014, 09:24:28 am
Woah, you guys really got cookin'! I'm very grateful you've decided to help us out, Chercheur. If you'd like anything forum-wise to be done, like exclusive translating threads that only you can see or etc, I can provide that for you.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on December 06, 2014, 12:10:19 pm
Wow! You're really translating it?! Awesome, and good luck! I can't tell you how excited I am to read the chapters! Now I won't have to bug you with so many questions, haha! :D I wish I could help, but I don't know a word of Japanese. :c If there's anything I can do to make it easier, maybe on CrystalofLie's side, don't hesitate to let me know!

You guys are my heroes. xD
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 06, 2014, 03:41:59 pm
Haha, well you know my novel is in french, not in japanese.

 I may repeat myself but I am just a student with a... medium (?) level. I need to use a reliable dictionary constantly because some words, some sentences in this novel are complex... and I don't want to write some... basic (?) words, those you use in daily life. I want to respect the entire novel.

Then, at the end, I provide the translation to CrystalOfLies in order to fix it and rephrase it if necessary. So the content on this forum will be the one from my novel, don't worry. But after the ultimate release, everyone can fix the translation, step by step, if changes are necessary.  ;)

So it takes some time, as long as you are patient, there won't be any problem.  :) If a new French (or someone being able to translate from french to english) wants to work with me, show yourself !  :P

For now, I don't need anything, thanks IMD.

EDIT : Chapter 1 is quite long, but I will release the translation the upcoming week. If I remember well, this is the longest chapter of the novel. There are some "funny" chapters too : chapter 29 = 1 page  :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: xx13 on December 07, 2014, 08:28:14 pm
So is this site full of girls who love final fantasy cause if so this is the best website ever
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 08, 2014, 01:44:35 am
But I'm a boy !  ;D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Cartouche on December 08, 2014, 06:04:44 am
Hi everyone !

It's your lucky day ChercheurObscur, you're not the only french guy now (then we can talk between us) !

This makes for a little while that I know the FFX-3 Chat which is famous, and because this is the only place for his revelations about the Final Fantasy X-2.5 novel.

I received the book the day of its French release and I read it (I'll read the novel a second time) but I do not know if I will participate in a possible full English translation for the moment, because it requires a lot of time and I prefer concentrate myself on my studies. Nevertheless, I am able to contribute on some details, no worries.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 08, 2014, 01:33:41 pm
I have a question ! Do you do necessarly the contraction of expressions such as "do not" "you are" in the conversations of a novel ?

But at the end, I'll let CrystalOfLies do the fixation if necassary.

EDIT : Chapter 1 translation done !  :D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Mandi Newton on December 09, 2014, 04:05:39 pm
May I ask where the translation is? I'm not seeing where you can read it...
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 09, 2014, 04:31:56 pm
Oh sorry, CrystalOfLies is "currently" fixing and rephrasing it, because I'm not a native. But it won't be too long, don't worry.  ;)

EDIT : The chapter 1 is online ! Enjoy ! So you decided to copy paste everything, CrystalOfLies... well I don't mind, but I will ask Internal Medecine Doctor to prevent everyone from posting in this new topic, else...  :P At the end, it's more clear this way, good job ;)

Just a strange sentence :

“Yuna seemed to take pleasure with the Gullwings activities, except for Paine, who said it loud and clear.

-> This is weird. In my translation, it is "took apart Paine"  ??? Should I have written "Paine took apart" ? Maybe you misunderstood because of this ?
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on December 10, 2014, 05:11:53 am
Maybe you mean 'apart from Paine'. 'Except for Paine' means the same thing.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 10, 2014, 06:21:18 am
Maybe you mean 'apart from Paine'. 'Except for Paine' means the same thing.

Maybe my translation is wrong... I thought "Take apart" was the verb "Throw" but in a speaking way. Do you understand ? If that's not the case, you can just use "say", it's alike.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on December 10, 2014, 03:32:51 pm
Oh, do you maybe mean "took away", as in, Paine UNDERSTOOD this? Or something like that? It is hard to explain. xD
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 11, 2014, 12:49:35 pm
Not really, maybe it is something specific to French language. I think the best is to delete this part, it's not like it's important.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Cartouche on December 12, 2014, 03:29:52 pm
Here are some preview images of the French edition that I did. This is the same copy as the Japanese edition.

Spoiler (hover to show)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 13, 2014, 01:07:13 pm
Chapter 2 comes tomorrow, please be excited !  :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on December 13, 2014, 02:08:18 pm
[ is excited! ]  ;D

And the book looks really nice! O: I didn't know it would be hardback and so fancy looking! I'd totally buy one, if only I could tell what it said xD
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on December 14, 2014, 01:11:51 am
Hi ChercheurObscur, thanks for taking the time to do this.  ;D I've been studying French for quite a while (English is my first language) So if you have any difficulty or questions, I'd be happy to give my opinion. Also, Lulu is a complete b!tch in this. If this translation's accurate, then they've really thrown her character development from the previous games out the window...   :-\
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on December 14, 2014, 05:00:55 am
Based on the first chapter, I kinda have to agree with you about lulu, mambo!

The sentiment of what she's saying and the desire to protect yuna is lulu-ish, yes. I can understand why she would say those things but... on the other hand, she seems almost to be disallowing yuna to speak for herself and ignoring all of Yunas character growth throughout x-2. As much as I think Lulu will always think of Yuna as her little sister and feel a need to protect her, the way she talks in the first chapter, she treats her almost like a child, and I would think that after everything lulu has seen Yuna go through, she would see her as not only capable but DESERVING of mmaking her own decisions, no matter how it effects yunas image. Granted, I think she only says these things because she thinks that it's what yuna would want (to protect her image and all) but at the same time shouldn't she recognize that Yuna has grown a lot on her journey in x-2? I don't know...... even for lulu, who is blunt and bossy, that seemed a bit much to me...  im torn about it.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 14, 2014, 05:07:26 am
Her baby may have changed her behaviour, no ? And since Wakka doesn't help with the "safety" of the baby...
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on December 14, 2014, 05:45:13 am
I noticed that Rikku was a bit out-of-the-loop as well. Sure, she's teasing and playful to Tidus most of the time, but in her introduction it's implied that she doesn't think Tidus deserves any respect for being one of Yuna's closest guardians. And what's with her random angry outbursts, especially at the end? I think it's supposed to further show that Tidus feels isolated from Spira because of his absence, but they were close friends during X. You'd think Rikku would be more happy to see him.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 14, 2014, 06:58:03 am
Well, Rikku is happy to see him, but Tidus does not really care about her and her histories, so if I was her I would have reacted the same way...
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on December 14, 2014, 09:04:10 am
Good points kk, that's the gist of what I'm saying too. Her personality can be short and bossy, but she was only downright mean and bully-like in the very begining of FFX, which she clearly softened throughout the game. You'd think after all Yuna's done, she'd be respectful of her instead of controlling (she had no problem with Yuna traveling the world in X-2, but now she treats her like a child locked in her room) 

Her comment toward Tidus about her relationship with Wakka "it's nothing extraordinary and honestly sometiimes I think I've had enough" made me cringe. It's just a nasty thing to say even when someone is currently annoying you. After all they've been through and the fact that the last we saw of them in X-2 was happy and sitting by a fire.... Unless the writer has someone saying in the book "Oh man, Lulu's been so mean and nasty since the baby's been born, but she has post partum depression and will snap out of it soon!" Then I'd be more forgiving. But according to this novel, she's on her way to being single and friendless.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on December 14, 2014, 09:21:25 am
Oh man, a subplot in X-3 is gonna be Lulu and Wakka's divorce, isn't it?

And then you have to choose early on whom to give custody of Vidina to, and only 1 answer will get you 100% in the end.

But seriously, Lulu seems to have become very rude post-X-2. It's not blatant, but it's definitely hidden under there. You see more of that with her insensitivity towards Tidus at the end of Will, and she did seem to get on Chuami's nerves (though that can apply with nearly everyone).
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on December 14, 2014, 10:38:59 am
Chapter 4 Mission Objective: Can you stop Wakka from putting his foot down?

Yeah, she even called Tidus' actions pathetic. I mean come on, no one's perfect. He's a nice guy who's trying to do the right thing (same can be said for Wakka) You know, the character Donna is kind of the same now that I think about it. "I'm really mean and everyone annoys me! (but I really care!)" "Bartello is such an idiot, I can't stand him! (but I really love him!) Even Chuami seems to have a similar personality. It's the kind of bi-polar behavior that I thought Lulu grew out of though..
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on December 14, 2014, 11:11:46 am
Personally, I think that the putdowns can mostly be described as just her humor/personality. Her and Wakka just have a weird relationship like that, imo. Kind of like the bumbling sitcom husband and his nagging wife. :p I feel like that's what the writers are going for, haha!

But her behavior WAS in fact changed by the baby, ChercheurObscur, but in the total opposite direction of this novel. In X-2, she's softened. There's an entire scene where she is nice and romantic with Wakka the ENTIRE TIME. Even admits out loud that she relies on him and trusts him!!! Very different than the Lulu we're used to, but I think it was growth based on the fact that the Calm has come and now she can let her guard down, emotionally and otherwise. She is able to love without fear of Sin taking those she loves from her. She can even have a child without fear of it being killed by Sin. So, she seemed much more at peace in X-2.

But in the novel, she seems to have regressed, based on this chapter, anyway. More relevant to our complaints, when Yuna returns to Besaid, Lulu just sort of jokes about how Yuna can "spread her wings", now that Lulu isn't there. No scolding. No yelling at. No "why are you wearing that"/"what are you doing"/"think of your IMAGE, yuna!!" I always took this to mean that Lulu was beginning to let Yuna grow into her own person. She was glad that Yuna was spreading her wings, and doing what she wanted to do, without fear of consequences. Because why wouldn't Lulu be? Lulu loves Yuna. She would want Yuna to be happy, wouldn't she? Even if that meant sacrificing her image or respect of the Besaid elders. S

It seems like regression  of her character to make her suddenly be bossy and controlling of Yuna again, like Yuna is a little kid incapable of deciding for herself how she wants to handle her own affairs. It would have been one thing for Lulu to give Tidus a word of caution. That would make sense. But no-- she straight up gave him ORDERS on how to treat Yuna. That seems... meh. Like I said, character development regression.

I'm worried they are doing this to Yuna (regression of her growth), too, but I'm reserving my judgement until I read more of the book! She's barely been in one chapter. More on that later, maybe-- but hopefully not! Hopefully my feeling is wrong. xD

Rikku, on the other hand... I understand when she bursts about Tidus not listening. I can see RIkku being like "hey, I am the greatest storyteller ever and these are the most exciting awesome tales of all time, you should be grateful I'm even sharing them with you, why aren't you listening to me?!" and getting mad at him for being distracted. xD BUT... why the heck would she leave the party?! Rikku loves parties and gatherings!!!! She doesn't want to be at the banquet???? That's just weird and seems like an excuse for the writers to shoo her off to another place. Maybe she was trying to give Yuna and tidus privacy, but for one, they aren't getting any in the first place, and two, since when is Rikku considerate of that? l o l
And I thought her outburst about the Fayth that drew all the villagers attention was just weird??? But I'm guessing it wasn't supposed to be ANGRY, just passionate. If so, that makes sense, I guess... she's just trying to make sure that Tidus recognizes how much Yuna went through to get him back. They DID have their moments of teasing and joking around together like the friends they were in X, so that made me happy!
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 14, 2014, 11:52:23 am
Chapter 2 is coming ! CrystalOfLies is fixing and rephrasing it.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on December 14, 2014, 01:14:48 pm
So it seems things are getting interesting! After a discouraging and hungry match of half-blitz, Tidus meets the ever-mysterious Briah and they form an equally-as-mysterious friendship. However, it doesn't help that Yuna is still being held captive by the village elders.

I wonder: Why does Briah seem so interested in where Tidus came from? Guess we'll find out later in the novel. Or in FFX-3. If it ever comes to.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on December 14, 2014, 01:56:46 pm
"He headed for the temple and filled his lungs with the familiar perfume, mixed with the smell of the damp stones that the building was releasing. He was happily reminded of his era of childhood.

A gift of Yevon..."


I'm confused at what this part means. He (Tidus?) was reminded of his childhood because of the temple? That seems odd... there doesn't seem to have been any temples in Dream Zanarkand. Maybe just because of the Fayth?

What is a gift of Yevon? Him, a dream? His childhood: i.e. dream Zanarkand? Something in the temple? Yuna? Is it purposely mysterious or am I missing something? xD
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 14, 2014, 02:10:35 pm
No no no ! this is not Tidus here but Wakka ! Tidus is still in the cove.

Chapter 3 deals with Kush and Valm...  :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on December 14, 2014, 02:16:46 pm
Oh, okay!! That makes much more sense. xD Much as I'm enjoying all the Tidus introspection, I'm glad the next chapter will be about Valm... since he's Briah. o.o Maybe it will help clear up some of the mystery of why he's on Besaid and why he's poking at Tidus!
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 14, 2014, 03:37:25 pm
Wait & see !  :P

Oops, I just noticed that my DL links were broken... FIXED !  :)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on December 14, 2014, 07:54:40 pm
I agree with everything you've said, kk!! That was the point I was trying to make as well, character development/progression from the first 2 games seems to have taken a nose dive. idk, I'll reserve my final judgement until the translation's complete. :)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: SilverPrince on December 15, 2014, 01:43:28 am
So Tidus is an incarnate spirit, what exactly does that mean?

And do we have an accurate definition of what an aeon core is?
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on December 15, 2014, 02:35:11 am
haha so I just realized something. Since Tidus is a "beckoned" soul who will disapear when he discovers his condition and in the audio drama, Sin is also "beckoned"... couldn't the people of Spira just gather around and scream "Sin! You're not real! Go back to the Farplane!" If Sin is self-aware and understands them, problem solved??  ??? Also, is there any way that this book could be uploaded in French?
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 15, 2014, 08:32:14 am
So Tidus is an incarnate spirit, what exactly does that mean?

And do we have an accurate definition of what an aeon core is?

An incarnate spirit is something/someone the death couldn't stop, such as aeons, some monsters or deceased persons, and even Sin, for example.

An aeon core is a fayth. It was a term used 1000 years ago. To be precise, an aeon core is the result of the creation (of the fayth), and, at that time, only the summoner who had created  the fayth could use its powers (because you needeed a strong bond between both of them). So everything was settled in advance (the couple).

haha so I just realized something. Since Tidus is a "beckoned" soul who will disapear when he discovers his condition and in the audio drama, Sin is also "beckoned"... couldn't the people of Spira just gather around and scream "Sin! You're not real! Go back to the Farplane!" If Sin is self-aware and understands them, problem solved??  ??? Also, is there any way that this book could be uploaded in French?

Well, Sin is quite special... he has come back to life a lot of time. Sin is just the "carcass" of Yu Yevon... What is exactly Yu Yevon, I don't remember ? (I mean, what kind of entity ?)

Also, is there any way that this book could be uploaded in French?

I can't. Maybe Cartouche ?
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on December 15, 2014, 10:59:34 am
I believe Yu Yevon was a normal human who summoned his aeon (Sin) to both combat Bevelle in the war and protect Dream Zanarkand, but Sin's awesome power drained him of most of his humanity and he and Sin soon forgot what their purpose was, instead destroying any trace of civilisation with exaggerated strength. He could have just been a human turned mutant by Sin's influence and old age killed him.

I'm in the belief that Yu Yevon, Seymour and Shuyin are all special kinds of unsent, since they are able to take control of other living bodies and do things in the 'living' world. Maybe they'll expand on that with these three new characters. They're all unsent themselves, after all.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Light_Fury on December 16, 2014, 09:00:11 am
if I had Yuna in front of me, I would ask "Why the **** did you go back Tidus and then treat him like **** ??"

....i'm sorry for my broken english...but I had to say it!
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 16, 2014, 09:30:30 am
As I have said before, I think that Ifahnal had schemed everything... the destruction of the boat, Tidus' death, etc.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on December 16, 2014, 01:47:03 pm
I know that Sin was just armor for Yu Yevon, I just wonder who's inside of his beckoned self and if he can hear others. Remember when he responded to the Hymn of Fayth? Who's Cartouche btw?
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 17, 2014, 02:01:14 pm
Cartouche is a French who bought the novel. Read some previous posts.

I will release Chapter 3 on friday. And just after, I will take a break until 01/19/2015 beauce of the holidays and my exams.

EDIT : Chapter 3 is coming ! COL is fixing it !  :D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Cartouche on December 19, 2014, 01:39:21 pm
Yep, I bought the novel because I am obviously French and of course because I love Final Fantasy X :) I added some pictures of the book on the previous page. By the way, there are others HERE (http://bouquindugamer.blogspot.fr/2014/12/final-fantasy-x-25-le-prix-de-leternite.html), but they do not are from me.

Furthermore, I can not upload all the content of the book, it would take me a lot of time. I think it is better to wait the English translation, and then it's a simpler language to understand ! I know that ChercheurObscur and CrystalOfLies will make the best possible translation !
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on December 19, 2014, 01:45:25 pm
A little bit on Valm's and Kushu's history this chapter.

First of all: the use of the word 'infernal'. There is a character with a similarly-spelled name. I actually smirked at that.

Second: We hear of an old folk tale of the Farplane: bad spirits get sent to Hell (apparently Hell is a place in Spira) while good spirits get turned into... flowers. Is that why we saw all of those purple flowers in the Farplane in X-2? That's actually kind of clever and creepy.

Third: I love how Valm has to whistle to call the Bedohls. If you know anything about X/X-2 I'm sure you know why the whistling part makes me feel giddy.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 19, 2014, 02:06:47 pm
bad spirits get sent to Hell (apparently Hell is a thing in Spira)

uuh... What do you mean here ? Hell is hell, Satan, etc... (but your sentence may be something special in english I don't know)

Also, keep in mind the last sentences of this chapter... In the future, you may merge them with something else...  :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Pyreflies_of_MJ on December 20, 2014, 12:50:10 am
Hold up...Square Enix issued an official French translation, but not an English one? Okay then, Square, I see how it is.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Pyreflies_of_MJ on December 20, 2014, 01:02:26 am
bad spirits get sent to Hell (apparently Hell is a thing in Spira)

uuh... What do you mean here ? Hell is hell, Satan, etc... (but your sentence may be something special in english I don't know)

Also, keep in mind the last sentences of this chapter... In the future, you may merge them with something else...  :P

Well, it's rather strange because the "Hell" that we know of has never been mentioned in Spira. The afterlife has always been only referred to as the Farplane, with no distinction between good and bad, or "Heaven" and "Hell".  Aside from the existence of souls, priests, monks and such, there is no direct reference to any of our real world folklore and religious beliefs, so it's kind of bizarre that there' d suddenly be mention of a "Hell" at all.

I don't even know what to make of that. It's akin to them talking about Roman Gods and Godesses. Hell is a concept of many religions on Earth, not in Spira. Ain't no Satan in Spira. Until, now apparently, lmao.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Pyreflies_of_MJ on December 20, 2014, 01:19:34 am
Chile...It's great that you're translating but I'm not even sure if I can read anymore of this novel stuff. I'm kind of in the mindset of washing my hands of it all. Square done pissed me off, they really showed some AUDACITY here, and I'm still mad.

Them editing the Last Mission stuff for example, still can't wrap my head around that one, that really was the last straw for me. As has been mentioned before with the novel, one of the most frustrating things about it is the apparent regression of character everyone's gone through. It's just a hot mess and I don't think it will ever appear as anything remotely close to "good" in my view. And I don't even understand the need for a back story, I mean, who cares about the history of some dead randoms on an island? And killing Tidus? No, babe, NO. Like KK said, they treat their precious Cloud and Lightning like gods, but Tidus is just a disposable joke apparently. Alright, then.

My trust in Square has diminished significantly from this fiasco (and really, the disappointment that was FFXIII as well). They can keep their little novel and I'm just going to pay it dust and pretend it never existed.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on December 20, 2014, 04:00:06 am
Hey, Pyreflies! You're back!

I'm still pretty mad about the tsundere-like behaviour everyone is displaying to Tidus, especially since it just seems to serve the purpose of dealing out contrived drama, but if the rest of the novella is anything like Che described earlier then I might be willing to give it a second chance.

Also I noticed that Tidus seems to be a lot more angry than usual. If it's all the stuff he's been through or if the fayth are just really bad at reconstructing pyreflies, who knows?

And YES about the 'Tidus is the butt of Final Fantasy protags' thing. Cloud is pretty much their mascot and I'm pretty sure Toriyama has a shrine of Lightning built somewhere in his house. Even Vaan gets more respect than poor Tiida. Even these new characters in the novel have more dignity and importance than him.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Pyreflies_of_MJ on December 20, 2014, 05:05:25 am
Hai Crystal! ^_^

Okay, so I read the first couple chapters, and BARELY made it through before just skimming the third one because no, I do not give a fawk about those other characters.   ::)

But anyway, my opinion can be summoned up with a NOPE. Nope, just no. SMH  :( Ay dios mio, none of that crap made sense, it was not enjoyable  - do not want, abort mission. I'm GOOD, they can keep that. Won't be reading further, it'll make me toss my cookies in revulsion.

But may I just say that the imagery of a dark mass of lord knows what extending beyond Tidus's feet in the ocean - how completely terrifying and foreshadowing of what's to come in this dreg of a book. That really set the tone well - the only "compliment" I'm willing to give.

Sorry guys, you are great for translating this thing, and ChercheurObscur - I've got mad respect for you, so sweet of you to dedicate the time and energy to this.

But I can't be positive about it one bit. In fact, the book itself is the antithesis of positive, which is what I  WANTED and expected, and that's why it's so devastating. If I wanted to partake in depressing angst, I'd turn on Lifetime.

All romantic charm has been cut out of this story with Freddy Kreuger's rusty talons. I really care about the original story and characters, the kinship expressed - that love and friendship, family, yaaaas. So this book is like watching a video of nothing but people kicking puppies and stomping on kittens. I'd rather do without.

Oh, but here's a brief character synopsis:

Lulu's being a b*itch, Rikku's being a b*tch, Yuna's being a stupid, spineless b*tch and Wakka is perhaps being more stupid and oblivious than he used to be, though at least he hasn't regressed to being racist - brownie points for Wakka, ya'll. And Tidus well, he probaby needs some Paxil.

Overall, I am CHARMED, guys, let me tell you. Can't you tell?  >_>
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on December 20, 2014, 11:22:53 am
Yeah, I totally understand you, Pyreflies!

I'm in it for morbid curiosities sake. There are actually some things about the novel I don't mind. A few details even that I like, or at least, find intriguing as a POSSIBILITY for the future of Spira/the characters, though I wouldn't want it to be canon by any means But for the most part, I'm just... even though I think most of the book is a crapshoot, I just have to know what it says. xD I'm trying so hard to give it a chance, but it's... difficult, when it honestly feels like Nojima just doesn't care about the well-developed characters and relationships that were given to us... the plot itself is interesting, but why did you have to do it at the expense of being in-character???? My favorite thing about the FF series is it's characters. They are what invest me in the games. So, to see them torn apart and lazily stitched into some caricature of themselves just for the sake of the novel/audio drama saddens me.

It's disappointing that they couldn't think of a way to continue the series by going FORWARD, instead of back. Because most things I've seen so far have been doing just that. Let's not create a new villain, let's just bring back Sin. Let's not develop the characters further, let's just make them the way they were YEARS ago. I'm reserving my final judgement until I know more, because MAYBE it will get better...... but for now. I'm not comforted by the contents of the book. ;_;

BUT, I am very very interested in them. I can't help but be intrigued in this insanity... and in trying to figure out Nojima's thought process for why he wrote these things....it's just such a trainwreck. I keep thinking, tHERE MUST BE A ULTIMATE REASON. There has to be some logical explanation for him writing these things. I want to believeeeee. xD But... there probably is none. Sigh.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on December 20, 2014, 12:19:57 pm
I think, much like Pyreflies, if Nojima had made this story a silly alternate timeline, kind of like a 'what-if' that could be delved into by fanfiction and not meant to be taken seriously, that this could be all right in my book and everyone else's. I mean, those ten/eleven years that X-2 came out, it was all pretty much set in our heads that Tidus and Yuna lived happily ever after and died of old age together. Now after all that time, Nojima just goes 'surely you jest tidus died a few days after and yuna might not love him any more.' Quite frankly, it's absurd and an insult to the die-hard fans of FFX: Sinzilla and X-2: Requiem For A Tidus.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 20, 2014, 01:49:08 pm
It seems like I have forgotten a lot about FFX-2 because the characters behavior doesn't surprise me.  ???

Pyreflies_of_MJ : You sould read Kush's and Valm's history, it is quite short but very sad...

Let's not create a new villain, let's just bring back Sin.

I disagree with you. Sin is not the villain here.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on December 20, 2014, 02:14:14 pm
Oh, no, I understand that Sin isn't the villain in the novel, but I'm criticizing both new additions at once, haha. The novel AND the audio drama, as it's looking more and more like the two are interconnected! It seems like the events of the audio drama don't make as much sense WITHOUT the novel, so in a way, one can't exist without the other.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on December 20, 2014, 02:32:19 pm
All we need from this book is an update from Kimahri "The Ronso no longer respect Kimahri for being a Guardian and kicked him out of their tribe because of his broken horn" and there's plenty of time to drag Wakka's racism out of the grave with all of this new Albhed lore! Seriously though, Yuna's regression is absolutely disgusting, Lulu's regressed to the point that it makes her look like she has a mental disorder, Rikku just seems odd, and even Wakka's backtracked quite a bit. He was maturing at the end of X-2, calming down, finally comfortable in his own shoes.. He seems to be none of that here.

I think Pyreflies hit the nail on the head when mentioning the sense of FAMILY that's being ignored in this novel. Every time you turn X on, a video of everyone solemnly sitting by a fire is shown. Those characters, despite their own personal troubles, were coming together and saving the world from a 1000 year CURSE. They were oppressed, had no hope for their futures, and the world as they thought they knew it was dissolving right before their eyes. Yet here they are sitting by a fire, pushing through fear and overcoming obstacles both personal and global TOGETHER. X-2 showed all of them maturing, regaining hope, growing confident in their futures. As corny as that game got sometimes, the character development was absolutely beautiful...And there's Tidus, progressing in X from foreigner to friend, a voice of optimism in a world with little hope (there's an NPC early in X, I can't remember where, who wondered whether the next Calm would even last a year!)

I just feel like Nojima has completely forgotten all of this. He wants to introduce a new enemy? Fine. Does Sin have something to do with this new enemy? Also fine. Just pleaaasssee don't mess with the character development! He's forgotten the growth of his characters and reduced them to mere caricatures of their old personalities. Lame.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on December 20, 2014, 03:05:42 pm
That's true. 'Family' was one of the main themes of X. Seven people, all different in personality, life goals, opinions and futures; going against the entire world and the corrupt system it's being held under just to bring peace to a land which might not even last very long. Six of those people are all loosely related to their past lives and try their best to support and comfort their shaken summoner, knowing how much of a demented hellhole Spira really was; a literal spiral of death.

The seventh person, Tidus, has no connections to any of these people save for Auron. He came from a much more comforting world and, thanks to the contrast, immediately noticed and questioned Spira's traditions and cultures. He came from somewhere where he could be genuinely happy, and Yuna and the others seeing this gave them the strength to go on. If it weren't for his optimism, Yuna might have given up hope too early. If it weren't for his curiosity, Yuna might have never contemplated the behind-the-scenes of Yevon's church. In fact, if he wasn't even there, Sin might very well have killed them all at either Operation Mi'ihen or Zanarkand Dome. So despite only knowing these people recently, he was just as vital to the journey and deserved a place in their circle. Their family, if you will.

Here comes the novella. People are already forgetting what he's done for them and his friends are not welcoming to him. The very position that brought him close to the gang (foreign and out-of-touch) is now isolating him and making him doubt himself. Alas, poor Tidus! I knew him, Nojima.

Once again: I don't hate the novella as much as I used to. I've gone from wanting to burn the book in molten magma to just... pitching it aside and taking it in jest. Just treating it like a fanfiction that's moderately more interesting than average, you know?
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on December 20, 2014, 03:39:47 pm
"It seems like I have forgotten a lot about FFX-2 because the characters behavior doesn't surprise me."

Chercher, they still have their quirky personalities, but the negative extremes of those personalities were recognized and gradually changed through X & X-2.
For example:
-Yuna at start of X: Is a do-gooder, but is also docile and a complete doormat.
-Yuna post X: Still a do-gooder but because of what she's been through, she's bolder and understands that she needs to stand up for herself and her wants.
-Yuna in this novel: Back to being docile and possibly a doormat tbd..

Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 20, 2014, 04:08:35 pm
In the case of Yuna, she is not as docile as before. It's just she feels responsible of what happened and doesn't want to abandon those who believed in Yevon. But during FFX-2, Tidus was more important for her, it can't be helped. Furthermore, in the next chapters of the novel, Yuna unmoors the boat in which Tidus goes into earlier, in order to have a romantic moment with him, without warning someone (Tidus was sleeping during this time). Finally, know that Yuna and Tidus will argue about her future.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on December 20, 2014, 04:22:48 pm
I understand all of that Crystal, maybe Yuna wasn't the best example.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 20, 2014, 04:42:50 pm
Well, I'm Chercheur not CrystalOfLies, the Yu Yevon avatar must have misled you !  :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on December 20, 2014, 04:54:14 pm
haha woah, sorry Chercheur  :P That icon totally threw me off. I'm on my phone which doesn't help either,  ;D

that Yu Yevon icon would look good on the back of a hoodie btw.  :D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Pyreflies_of_MJ on December 20, 2014, 07:43:05 pm
All we need from this book is an update from Kimahri "The Ronso no longer respect Kimahri for being a Guardian and kicked him out of their tribe because of his broken horn" and there's plenty of time to drag Wakka's racism out of the grave with all of this new Albhed lore! Seriously though, Yuna's regression is absolutely disgusting, Lulu's makes her look like she has a mental disorder, Rikku's is odd, and even Wakka's is kind of sad. He was maturing at the end of X-2, calming down, finally comfortable in his own shoes.. He seems to be none of that here.

I think Pyreflies hit the nail on the head when mentioning the sense of FAMILY that's being ignored in this novel. Every time you turn X on, a video of everyone solemnly sitting by a fire is shown. Those characters, despite their own personal troubles, were coming together and saving the world from a 1000 year CURSE. They were oppressed, had no hope for their futures, and the world as they thought they knew it was dissolving right before their eyes. Yet here they are sitting by a fire, pushing through fear and overcoming obstacles both personal and global TOGETHER. X-2 showed all of them maturing, regaining hope, growing confident in their futures. As corny as that game got sometimes, the character development was absolutely beautiful...And there's Tidus, progressing in X from foreigner to friend, a voice of optimism in a world with little hope (there's an NPC early in X, I can't remember where, who wondered whether the next Calm would even last a year!)

I just feel like Nojima has completely forgotten all of this. He wants to introduce a new enemy? Fine. Does Sin have something to do with this new enemy? Also fine. Just pleaaasssee don't mess with the character development! He's forgotten the growth of his characters and reduced them to mere caricatures of their old personalities. Lame.
That's true. 'Family' was one of the main themes of X. Seven people, all different in personality, life goals, opinions and futures; going against the entire world and the corrupt system it's being held under just to bring peace to a land which might not even last very long. Six of those people are all loosely related to their past lives and try their best to support and comfort their shaken summoner, knowing how much of a demented hellhole Spira really was; a literal spiral of death.

The seventh person, Tidus, has no connections to any of these people save for Auron. He came from a much more comforting world and, thanks to the contrast, immediately noticed and questioned Spira's traditions and cultures. He came from somewhere where he could be genuinely happy, and Yuna and the others seeing this gave them the strength to go on. If it weren't for his optimism, Yuna might have given up hope too early. If it weren't for his curiosity, Yuna might have never contemplated the behind-the-scenes of Yevon's church. In fact, if he wasn't even there, Sin might very well have killed them all at either Operation Mi'ihen or Zanarkand Dome. So despite only knowing these people recently, he was just as vital to the journey and deserved a place in their circle. Their family, if you will.

Here comes the novella. People are already forgetting what he's done for them and his friends are not welcoming to him. The very position that brought him close to the gang (foreign and out-of-touch) is now isolating him and making him doubt himself. Alas, poor Tidus! I knew him, Nojima.

Once again: I don't hate the novella as much as I used to. I've gone from wanting to burn the book in molten magma to just... pitching it aside and taking it in jest. Just treating it like a fanfiction that's moderately more interesting than average, you know?

Guys, YES. Here comes a rant.  ;)

In the ending FMV when we see Tidus returning back to Besaid with Yuna, it looked liked ALL of the island had come out of the woodwork to see them. They knew who Tidus was (and if they didn't they seemed curious), they knew what was up and they were STOKED. It was such a positive atmosphere and it felt good to see that Tidus was being reunited with his family. Yuna's guardians and by extension - the people of Besaid, they were his new family. If it were a feature film, I'd expect "We Are Family" by Sister Sledge to start blasting while everybody hugs it out.

But here comes the opening of the book and all that falls on its ass. People act like they are not here for Tidus AT ALL, I'm like damn. Seymour's crazy ass may as well have come out of the ocean because Besaid is not giving any f*cks about Tidus and it's a shame. Nobody even gave him a hug - chile, what? We know damn well that Tidus would have gotten ALL the hugs.

Rikku, Lulu and Yuna were especially out of pocket, just what the hell happened? Why is Yuna's b*tch ass all up the butts of people in town, empathizing with some cult, paying no mind to her man, who, let's not forget because Besaid sure did, just came back from the f*cking dead. She's too nice, the book says, riiight. You nailed when you said she's acting like she's got brain damage. Girl was trippin' and so was the rest of the island. Tidus is just like WTF,  while people give him dirty looks - really? If it weren't for him ya'll would be fish food for Sin, but you're going to act real band new and pretend like he's not a legendary guardian. Okay. You mean to tell me that NOBODY knows who Tidus is or his significance, and if that was the case, that NOBODY was going to school your asses on that glaringly important fact? Okay, bish.

Yuna's apparently lost all the gumption and free will she gained over the course of two games, and she can't even recognize when BS is going down - and Besaid was most definitely on some BS. She could have stepped up and made an announcement to everyone about Tidus and what was going on, how a hero had returned and how they should be thankful and welcoming, but she acted like a straight coward and it is sad. She could have at least excused herself, but no. I can't even respect her. She should have known how insecure he felt, I want to SLAP her ass! He sure as f*ck wouldn't treat her like that. You think he'd be signing blitzballs and s*it when he's been without you, looking for you for years? Girl.

You don't deserve Tidus anymore, ho, why don't you shack up with one of those thirsty ass clowns from New Yevon. See you in Bevelle, bish. >_>

Nobody made Tidus feel particularly welcome, or loved or a part of the family. FAIL. It's not even remotely realistic and I've seen some people argue that is but I'm like please. When something major happens, people put their bulls*it aside and take in the moment. No one was there to celebrate that moment with Tidus, and he felt like sh*t as a result. Maybe the Aurochs welcomed him, though. Okay, ya'll, good job, but nobody cared about you guys in the game and nobody does now. They are such a boring non-factor that I forgot they were mentioned at all. Somehow, Tidus is getting more love from a Blitzball team than from his girlfriend. Funny stuff.

And Rikku's acting like a diva. She knows damn well that Tidus wants to see Yuna more than anything and that he's probably feeling some kind of way from being ignored. Rikku can be immature, but dude, she ain't dumb and she wasn't acting understanding at all. It was like she couldn't read the situation for what it was and then she got too much in her feelings and had a tantrum. Girl, dang, way to be a brat. Bish, why in hell would he feel like listening to you tell a story when he probably wanted to hear that all from Yuna in the first place? People done misplaced their brains all over the damn place in this book. That girl is supposed to be the least uptight and yet here she is, doing the most.

And Lulu, hell. We all know she's got a reputation for being low key sassy, she'll insult your ass right quick. But she simmered down a lot and became more warm. When the baby was on the way she got extra maternal, but damn if her maternal instincts took a seat when Tidus came out the ocean. And you'd think that since she's such an important figure in Besaid, she could tell people to back the f*ck off from Yuna, but no, she gives no f*cks either and somehow characters I liked are being ultra unlikable. She was actually supporting Yuna's BS and telling Tidus to back off. SAY WHAT, HOE!? You guys f*cking renounced Yevon, and know first hand how bad it can be. You washed your hands of that s*it and know better than to cater to people who are blinded by religion, but suddenly everyone's in a cult mindset once again. IT'S A DAMN SHAME.

They were all trying WAY too hard and doing TOO much for people who are not in the "fam"- can we say priorities, Yuna's were twisted as hell. I can practically imagine Yuna being like "Oh, I'll be right with ya' Tidus, let me just go suck this monk's d*ck first." It is sickening, those people were not respecting her or Tidus, but she felt the need to coddle them, so much for a strong heroine.  ::) There is no excuse for Yuna not talking to Tidus immediately, let alone days after the fact. Besaid Village is not that f*cking big, b*tch, it's got a population of like 32 and people live in straw huts. Take a seat, it is not that serious.

I read a fic once that was real cute. It was right after Tidus returned and Yuna didn't want to let go of his hand for a long time thereafter. Even as he was being introduced to others and such. She was insecure about losing him again and clingy, it was sweet. What is sweet about this book? Not a damn thing, as far as I can see. Next.

And Wakka, pssh, I'm not even gonna' waste my breath on that fool. He acts like he's been smokin' too much weed, doesn't know what the f*ck is going on and is okay with that.

The thing is, it wouldn't even be such a thang if everyone was actually in-character, it's like you guys say. The Farplane could be pouring out zombies and Spira could be in the midst of famine, genocide and rampant disease - but if they all just stuck together and cared for one-another I'd stomach it. That's the difference between a good story and a piece of sh*t. They weren't supposed to just tap out on each other, I wanted to feel something besides tension,  sadness and awkward. And don't get me started on the rehashing of old sh*t, lawd, Square couldn't come up with an original story so they recycled the original one + extra contrived drama, just add milk.

The weight of the previous character development was shattered and we're left with hollow characters with tattered connections. It's lost its heart and its painfully evident with only a couple chapters. I hope I'm not being too abrasive or explicit, lmao, this stuff brings out my SASS.  :D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on December 21, 2014, 04:34:03 am
-claps- Pyreflies, you never cease to amaze me with your speeches.

Let's look at this from Tidus' point of view some more. In X, he and his friends took down a centuries-old false religion that was masking the truth to defeating Sin. Throughout half of the game, the maesters have declared them traitors, they sent Dark Aeon assassins after them, pretty much told Yuna that her father's sacrifice was useless and one particularly crazy maester tried to kill, deceive and manipulate them multiple times. They are hypocrites (use machina), self-aware (Mika stops Seymour's sending because he is unsent too) and cowards (Mika runs away to the Farplane, leaving Yevon in shambles).

Come X-2, with the rise of New Yevon (and yes, Tidus knows this because Rikku told him, not Yuna. Yeah Yuna, how consistent is your narration in that game since you are telling Tidus everything that's happened!?). While not as evil as the original Yevon, their scheme was to find spheres pertaining to Spira's history and hide them deep underground, therefore pretty much wiping out the knowledge of Spira's past. They were under the belief that memories of the past were weaknesses and not part of someone's... well, soul. And with the defeat of Trema, that matter is resolved.

Here comes the return of Tidus, who sacrificed his life to both defy Yevon and put an end to Spira's curse once and for all. Now he sees that the Yevon lifestyle is slowly seeping back into Spira, and nobody is attempting to question or even joke around with the fact that it was one of the causes of Spira's near-downfall. Somehow he has been launched back to square one, where Yuna cares more about her and others' beliefs in Yevon than the man who was just washed up on shore, likely very lost and confused, not to mention very insecure. And even in X, she excused herself to introduce herself to him. No such thing here. Wow. Yuna has absolutely no respect or empathy for him, despite mourning and hoping he'll come back for two years. It reminds me of those horrible boy/girlfriends we've all had who will abuse or ignore you, but then cry and wail and threaten to kill themselves if you even bring up the idea of breaking up with them.

But yeah, Yevon's coming back, everyone knows it. And Tidus, once again, tries to stand up to the BS and call them out on it but once again, they laugh him off and sneer at him. Not even three years in and Spira is already repeating history! Maybe the fayth sent him back because they sensed that Spira was going to dig itself a booby-trapped volcanic hole again, lmao. No wonder he fled to Bevelle at the time of Will. He just had Besaid, his new home, turned into a nursing home for the poor, oppressed, totally innocent h*rdcore Yevon-supporters. Who would most likely kill him.

Heck, at the end of Chapter 2 we see Tidus in a situation where he is lonely, hungry, confused and sitting on a pontoon close to tears. Like a local stray dog that's being avoided by the townsfolk because it might have fleas. Meanwhile everyone else is having a jolly good time at the party. You know, the one where Tidus was forced to help set up and when he realised that everyone he knew and loved had shredded every last ounce of empathy for him? Nobody even notices that he's gone. They're all concerned with Yuna instead.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 21, 2014, 07:48:25 am
I wonder why you think like that. Tidus is back, ok, but the villagers came in the cove because of Yuna's return, not for Tidus, they didn't know about it. Furthermore, you seem to forget that Tidus is almost an unknown for everyone. He spent only one day on Besaid in FFX ! And at the end, he disappears before the great meeting in Luca stadium. He is a complete unknown in Spira, except for some people. You can't blame people to ignore him.

Yuna or someone else could have told people about him, ok, but it's not as if they were rejecting him.
Yuna could have spent some time with Tidus before meeting the elders, ok, but is it tragedy ? No, everything was planned by Nojima : I said that they will argue about her future (so her behavior is involded in their conversation) in a previous post, but it appears that you didn't read it... This moment is very instructive.

So please, stop being scandalmonder sometimes. If you don't like the case of Yuna and Tidus (I am not talking about the others), ok, it's your choice, but please don't say the novel itself is bad about this point, you can't blame Nojima about it. :-\ The most funny here is that, starting from Chapter 5, they will spend ther time "together" until the end of the novel.

 
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on December 21, 2014, 11:54:35 am
Yeah, personally, I'm trying to wait to see what else develops before judging Yuna's change of character. I'm definitely wary. Yes, it makes sense for Yuna to care about the elders a lot. For one, they're villagers, and I think she cares about the entire village of Besaid as if they were family, really. So it would be hard for her to just be like "OKAY  THAT'S ENOUGH, OLD PEOPLE, SHUT UP NOW", haha. That's just not how she is. xD And two, she probably feels guilty about the fact that she caused so many of them emotional turmoil by overthrowing Yevon, basically. It was very hard for HER to accept Yevon's lies and betrayal, so she understands that they may need a little extra help.

But this novel takes place right after a game where Yuna embraces her own self and begins to think for herself and care about her own happiness, instead of just pleasing others. That's like, the entire point of X-2. So for Nojima to take it to the extreme that she is SO devoutly worried about these villagers that she is willing to more or less completely ignore Tidus and ignore her own wants... it looks weird.

I just feel that Nojima went overboard. I mean, in the X-2 ending, her and Tidus go running down the beach hand in hand, and she says she's gonna tell him her story, and she's so enthusiastic to be with him...... and then, what happens? The old Yevon ladies swoop in and carry her away on their backs? She never tells him her story like she says: everyone else tells him. It just seems weird to go from Tidus and Yuna running to the beach together to see all of their friends, and... then, suddenly, Yuna doesn't speak to any of her friends for the entire day. And considering the villagers in X-2 clearly recognized Yuna, but never once acted this insanely possessive towards her during her return to Besaid, nor did Yuna ever act this insanely coddling to them in that entire game... this whole thing just seems quite bizarre and over the top. It's very out of line with X-2. It's like it almost completely disregards the events of X-2. If it had went on for a few hours? Sure. But... hasn't it been like an entire day? Tidus sleeps like 3 whole times before he even gets to speak a word to the girl who just fought tooth and nail to get him back, haha

But since apparently she's soon going to stop pandering to the Yevoners and run away in the night soon, I guess it's alright... I just still think it's weird, especially combined with rumors of behavior we hear about later in the book, BUUUUUT I'm not going to judge it harshly until I see what exactly she does in the rest of the book! He could have probably just toned the first two chapters down a notch, is all. Maybe it didn't need to go on soooo long, making it look like Tidus is really lonely and practically shunned by the rest of the characters. Because that's really how it sounds and it's just a strange way to start the novel...  ???

Lulu's and Rikku's oddities are annoying, but since the book isn't centered around them, I can forgive it if they redeem Yuna. xD
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 21, 2014, 12:32:19 pm
I just feel that Nojima went overboard. I mean, in the X-2 ending, her and Tidus go running down the beach hand in hand, and she says she's gonna tell him her story, and she's so enthusiastic to be with him...... and then, what happens? The old Yevon ladies swoop in and carry her away on their backs? She never tells him her story like she says: everyone else tells him. It just seems weird to go from Tidus and Yuna running to the beach together to see all of their friends, and... then, suddenly, Yuna doesn't speak to any of her friends for the entire day.

I agree with you about this point ( I mean Yuna tells him she has experienced a lot of things and Tidus tells her he wants to know everything, and after...  :P )
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Pyreflies_of_MJ on December 21, 2014, 08:52:14 pm
Yeah, personally, I'm trying to wait to see what else develops before judging Yuna's change of character. I'm definitely wary. Yes, it makes sense for Yuna to care about the elders a lot. For one, they're villagers, and I think she cares about the entire village of Besaid as if they were family, really. So it would be hard for her to just be like "OKAY  THAT'S ENOUGH, OLD PEOPLE, SHUT UP NOW", haha. That's just not how she is. xD And two, she probably feels guilty about the fact that she caused so many of them emotional turmoil by overthrowing Yevon, basically. It was very hard for HER to accept Yevon's lies and betrayal, so she understands that they may need a little extra help.

But this novel takes place right after a game where Yuna embraces her own self and begins to think for herself and care about her own happiness, instead of just pleasing others. That's like, the entire point of X-2. So for Nojima to take it to the extreme that she is SO devoutly worried about these villagers that she is willing to more or less completely ignore Tidus and ignore her own wants... it looks weird.

I just feel that Nojima went overboard. I mean, in the X-2 ending, her and Tidus go running down the beach hand in hand, and she says she's gonna tell him her story, and she's so enthusiastic to be with him...... and then, what happens? The old Yevon ladies swoop in and carry her away on their backs? She never tells him her story like she says: everyone else tells him. It just seems weird to go from Tidus and Yuna running to the beach together to see all of their friends, and... then, suddenly, Yuna doesn't speak to any of her friends for the entire day. And considering the villagers in X-2 clearly recognized Yuna, but never once acted this insanely possessive towards her during her return to Besaid, nor did Yuna ever act this insanely coddling to them in that entire game... this whole thing just seems quite bizarre and over the top. It's very out of line with X-2. It's like it almost completely disregards the events of X-2. If it had went on for a few hours? Sure. But... hasn't it been like an entire day? Tidus sleeps like 3 whole times before he even gets to speak a word to the girl who just fought tooth and nail to get him back, haha

But since apparently she's soon going to stop pandering to the Yevoners and run away in the night soon, I guess it's alright... I just still think it's weird, especially combined with rumors of behavior we hear about later in the book, BUUUUUT I'm not going to judge it harshly until I see what exactly she does in the rest of the book! He could have probably just toned the first two chapters down a notch, is all. Maybe it didn't need to go on soooo long, making it look like Tidus is really lonely and practically shunned by the rest of the characters. Because that's really how it sounds and it's just a strange way to start the novel...  ???

Lulu's and Rikku's oddities are annoying, but since the book isn't centered around them, I can forgive it if they redeem Yuna. xD

Quoted for EMPHASIS! Right!? That's what I'm sayin'. In X-2 you visit Besaid MULTIPLE times and not once does the village get in her business. You even celebrate the birth of Lu's baby and everything, there are a variety of missions that take place on Besaid - and there was nary a single psychotic Yevon-obsessed elder trying to monopolize Yuna's time. In fact, the people of the village were sporting a chill attitude about everything, it was nice. It did not feel stuffy at all, and the confrontation with Beclem showed that if anything, the village was trying to move away from vestiges of Yevon.

The only people latching on for dear life were in Bevelle. While Besaid remained largely neutral during the New Yevon/Youth League conflict, many people from Besaid had sided with the Youth League - including the Aurochs. In general, it seemed as though people were looking towards new horizons, not the past. The time of Sin was over and people no longer sought out summoners for guidance like they did before. (Until just now, when they decided to resurrect Sin, but let's not even go there. >_>)

This sh*t came WAY out of left field, it doesn't make any sense with the established canon. It's like Nojima re-wrote the history of the game, that is not alright.

And also, it's not like Besaid knew about their impending doom with the whole Shuyin/Vegnagun thing. All of that was kept low key. Besaid had no idea Yuna and co just saved the world again, what would explain their massive flocking to see her and crowd her personal space? She'd been to Besaid often since she left, it doesn't make sense for them to act so brand new.

Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Pyreflies_of_MJ on December 21, 2014, 09:57:38 pm
I wonder why you think like that. Tidus is back, ok, but the villagers came in the cove because of Yuna's return, not for Tidus, they didn't know about it. Furthermore, you seem to forget that Tidus is almost an unknown for everyone. He spent only one day on Besaid in FFX ! And at the end, he disappears before the great meeting in Luca stadium. He is a complete unknown in Spira, except for some people. You can't blame people to ignore him.

Yuna or someone else could have told people about him, ok, but it's not as if they were rejecting him.
Yuna could have spent some time with Tidus before meeting the elders, ok, but is it tragedy ? No, everything was planned by Nojima : I said that they will argue about her future (so her behavior is involded in their conversation) in a previous post, but it appears that you didn't read it... This moment is very instructive.

So please, stop being scandalmonder sometimes. If you don't like the case of Yuna and Tidus (I am not talking about the others), ok, it's your choice, but please don't say the novel itself is bad about this point, you can't blame Nojima about it. :-\ The most funny here is that, starting from Chapter 5, they will spend ther time "together" until the end of the novel.

 

To be honest, I don't know how to accurately address the villagers coming to the cove - it's a little ambiguous. As I mentioned in my previous comment, they didn't know about Vegnagun, and previous drama in the temple had been abated already. Yuna and co had been to Besaid and fixed the problems, such as the fiends pouring from the temple and Dark Valefor - the last trip to Besaid ended on a peaceful note. These people were not so hyped to see Yuna before, even upon her first return. Lulu was a bit concerned that she left without saying anything, but that was it.

So it really doesn't make sense for the whole village to have come just to see Yuna, I thought it was implied that they were excited to see Yuna and Tidus reunited once again - which was by any account - a miracle. Realistically, I don't know how the hell those people got to the beach so quickly, or how they could have known - chalk it up to video game magic, but it seemed clear that at least some of them recognized Tidus or could tell something important and special was happening.

In any case, the atmosphere from X-2 was colossally different from what we are presented with here. It really appears as if Nojima forgot or blatantly ignored many things from X-2, both major and minor. And X-2 was a game that was all about the the little stuff, it's why the character development worked so well. Nojima didn't make the most out of the post-Sin Spira that was established.

As far as Tidus not being known, I think that's up for debate. You're absolutely right, he wasn't in Besaid for long, in terms of the main pilgrimage. But if you recall, you have the option of traveling Spira some more before facing Sin. You can actually go back through the world and have new conversations with people you met in the beginning, like the scene that's triggered with Clasko by boarding the S.S. Liki - which you have to visit Besaid to get to. My point is it can be argued that Tidus came to know and familiarize himself with the people of Besaid beyond his initial dumping into Spira.

But if that's too far-fetched or not canonical enough, there's the fact that legendary guardians are treated like royalty in FFX. Auron was granted massive respect and was regarded as something of hero from a fairy tale. Tidus was not only a legendary guardian, he actually helped defeat Sin for good, which is something no one beyond Yuna's party can boast of.

He should actually be considered a historical figure, and Besaid should know about him, regardless off whether they do or not. It's a tradition for people to memorialize the dead to great effect, and Yuna even said herself that they must never forget the lives that were lost or the "dreams that have faded." It's possible Yuna wanted to possessively hold his presence close to her by not telling anyone, that it may have been difficult. But now that he's back, what's her excuse for not sharing his importance?

Tidus seemed upset that he wasn't getting any respect in Besaid - and he was damn right. People keep telling me Nojima must have had all kinds of noble reasons for what he wrote, both in he novel and the audio drama. But the more that is revealed, the more it feels like there really is no real meaning behind any of it. He just wanted drama and controversy. He wanted to dispel the light theme of FFX-2 and replace it with angst, misery and darkness. Most fans didn't want that, and the backlash is the result.

I remember thinking, okay, there must be a reason behind Yuna's tragic behavior in the drama, and that Sin is probably not the real antagonist - but, yeah, I've lost the desire to make sense out of it. Nojima regressed the crap out of these characters, they are all exhibiting their worst flaws and not much else. What is the legitimate excuse for that?

As far as them arguing about their future goes, it's difficult to absorb any potential dialogue between them because the initial feeling has been so bad. If this book were a video game, I wouldn't have kept playing. I'm not eager to see what unfurls because it started off on the worst possible note it could have played. The Yuna/Tidus dynamic was a special one and Nojima really messed it up for me. I don't see how it can be redeemed, to tell the truth, and I'll likely feel alienated by everything that follows between Tidus and Yuna - especially an argument, that shouldn't even be on the table right now. There's no reason why Yuna should feel obligated to play some role immediately, she's supposed to be starting her new story independent from the desires of others, and Tidus just came back.

The atmosphere should be loving, playful, not full of contempt and arguments, dear God. Angst and petty squabbles do not interest me here. Their relationship has barely had a chance to get off the runway and Nojima decides to throw an argument in for fun - it feels so fake. Arguments are a natural part of any relationship, but even in X, it's clear that that drama didn't play a role in their bond.

One of the big rumors about the book was that Yuna appeared to be "tired" of him, that she thought he was being too childish. If that is true, it's all the more sickening. So far, I really don't like Yuna. She was ridiculous in the audio drama and she's ridiculous in the book - so far- and by most accounts and reviews I've seen of the thing. And what's more is that Tidus just takes it. He just accepts Yuna's bulls*hit. No, Tidus, no. Stand up for yourself, goddammit. >_>

What have I taken way from all this? Nojima should not be allowed to write anything by himself.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Pyreflies_of_MJ on December 22, 2014, 12:26:12 am
-claps- Pyreflies, you never cease to amaze me with your speeches.

Let's look at this from Tidus' point of view some more. In X, he and his friends took down a centuries-old false religion that was masking the truth to defeating Sin. Throughout half of the game, the maesters have declared them traitors, they sent Dark Aeon assassins after them, pretty much told Yuna that her father's sacrifice was useless and one particularly crazy maester tried to kill, deceive and manipulate them multiple times. They are hypocrites (use machina), self-aware (Mika stops Seymour's sending because he is unsent too) and cowards (Mika runs away to the Farplane, leaving Yevon in shambles).

Come X-2, with the rise of New Yevon (and yes, Tidus knows this because Rikku told him, not Yuna. Yeah Yuna, how consistent is your narration in that game since you are telling Tidus everything that's happened!?). While not as evil as the original Yevon, their scheme was to find spheres pertaining to Spira's history and hide them deep underground, therefore pretty much wiping out the knowledge of Spira's past. They were under the belief that memories of the past were weaknesses and not part of someone's... well, soul. And with the defeat of Trema, that matter is resolved.

Here comes the return of Tidus, who sacrificed his life to both defy Yevon and put an end to Spira's curse once and for all. Now he sees that the Yevon lifestyle is slowly seeping back into Spira, and nobody is attempting to question or even joke around with the fact that it was one of the causes of Spira's near-downfall. Somehow he has been launched back to square one, where Yuna cares more about her and others' beliefs in Yevon than the man who was just washed up on shore, likely very lost and confused, not to mention very insecure. And even in X, she excused herself to introduce herself to him. No such thing here. Wow. Yuna has absolutely no respect or empathy for him, despite mourning and hoping he'll come back for two years. It reminds me of those horrible boy/girlfriends we've all had who will abuse or ignore you, but then cry and wail and threaten to kill themselves if you even bring up the idea of breaking up with them.

But yeah, Yevon's coming back, everyone knows it. And Tidus, once again, tries to stand up to the BS and call them out on it but once again, they laugh him off and sneer at him. Not even three years in and Spira is already repeating history! Maybe the fayth sent him back because they sensed that Spira was going to dig itself a booby-trapped volcanic hole again, lmao. No wonder he fled to Bevelle at the time of Will. He just had Besaid, his new home, turned into a nursing home for the poor, oppressed, totally innocent h*rdcore Yevon-supporters. Who would most likely kill him.

Heck, at the end of Chapter 2 we see Tidus in a situation where he is lonely, hungry, confused and sitting on a pontoon close to tears. Like a local stray dog that's being avoided by the townsfolk because it might have fleas. Meanwhile everyone else is having a jolly good time at the party. You know, the one where Tidus was forced to help set up and when he realised that everyone he knew and loved had shredded every last ounce of empathy for him? Nobody even notices that he's gone. They're all concerned with Yuna instead.

You told no lies. And can I just say, dear God, can they stop giving so much of a crap about Yuna!? F*** YUNA, lmao! They've been making everything far too Yuna-centric, while at the same time making her less likable - how does that work? All I can do is look at Yuna like this:
(https://31.media.tumblr.com/0b85f0d4efaa4a72bddf0cda98456d36/tumblr_inline_mswmjdrlsu1qz4rgp.gif)

And it's not even just about Tidus, because FFX-2 was also about her personal journey. She came into herself more than ever before and seemed eager to start a new story for herself, but now here she is trying to please everyone like a noble acolyte. That crap got old two games ago, hon, let's move on. You don't have to be a martyr every second of your life.

But what you said about Besaid becoming a den for Yevonites and Tidus leaving - yas. That was one of the most glaring things about the audio drama. Tidus's ass is in Bevelle.... He is literally on another continent from Yuna, it sounds really bad. It certainly didn't seem like a temporary thing and Tidus appeared stressed even before Yuna broke up with him - or whatever that was that she did. (http://www.lipstickalley.com/images/smilies/Pidgin%20Smilies/disdain.png) Lord, it's pretty telling when you have to run away to Bevelle, a place where they all had some pretty crap experiences.

Look at that map, you see how far that is, L.O.L 

(http://www.freespacetime.com/proj2/images/spiramap.jpg)

And you know, I still don't understand how we are supposed to interpret Yuna's narrative voice. I always thought she was talking to his "ghost" basically, but you've raised the point that she was actually talking to him about their journey after he's come back and the game is a flash back - the reason that doesn't make sense to me is because there were several instances when she would talk to him in present tense, saying she wished he was there with her and how she missed him, their moments, etc.

This was especially the case in the mission in Chapter 5 where you go to Luca and relive all the memories with the moogle apparition thing, and also when she visits the spring in Macalania. There's also the option of not bringing Tidus back, which would in effect negate the possibility of her talking to Tidus for "real". I just figured that her saying "it all started when I saw this sphere of you", was merely an inward refection and her not talking to Tidus for once - but perhaps you're right,  it's actually confused the mess out of me. :P

In either case, though, it's clear the continuity was lost. Doesn't add up either way you spin it. Either she was eager to talk to him beyond the grave, or she was eager to relate every morsel of their story to him - the Yuna from the novel/drama ain't echoing that shiz.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Pyreflies_of_MJ on December 22, 2014, 05:17:49 am
And let me just offer a disclaimer here (I'll try not to ramble):

At one time I was extremely reverent of Square Enix and I praised the company to the Gods. They were consistent, they seemed to care about fans and created great franchises. And even if I don't love all FF titles I've played, I could find something to like about them and finished them anyway. (and hey, I've always loved Kingdom Hearts I/II)

But Final Fantasy X was actually my first JRPG, and I fell in love with it a good decade ago. While X-2 may have some iffy spots, it is also a great game and I basically consider them both to be one entity. After 10 years and many more games, FFX/X-2 is still hands down my favorite. I felt such an emotional connection to Tidus and Yuna as a couple, as soulmates.

The original lore and character development was perfect as is and I never would have thought for a moment, that Square would touch it. I didn't even think they'd realistically do anything else with this project, though I wanted them to. I was always up for a X-3, but I surely didn't think they'd butcher it in such a way. When I initially read about the contents of the novel and what happens to Tidus, I seriously balled my eyes out, I was devastated. And everything else was just salt on the wound. Square also was incredibly misleading about it all, the promotional material and teasers pointed in an entirely different direction. Square Enix slapped fans like me in the face, fans who are probably way too emotionally invested in a video game - but ha, that's alright

So while my posts may seem obnoxious intense at times, that's just my gut reaction. I can't help but make this all into a joke, because that's what it feels like. Square has basically said that they're not even going to continue with any of it - now that is the real punchline. But at least it gives me more justification in ignoring it, because they seem to be doing the same thing.

Why they are endorsing an additional translation of the novel that bombed? I have no idea. But really, thank you ChercheurObscur for translating it. Much love to you, and I do appreciate that you are willing to be open-minded about the book and how it relates to the original works. I just can't personally be that way, it's really hard for me, but I never intend to offend. ^_^
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 22, 2014, 06:52:00 am
Well, you know, Square Enix didn't publish the novel in France, it is Lumen Editions (google it if you want). I wrote a good review about this novel and Square Enix read it.

About Tidus, I have a theory : What if Tidus was making people as if they were still acting with their FFX behavior ? Or, if you prefer : What if people were acting as Tidus would like them to ? You know, like the dead and the living in the farplane...

Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on December 22, 2014, 07:52:08 am
About Tidus, I have a theory : What if Tidus was making people as if they were still acting with their FFX behavior ? Or, if you prefer : What if people were acting as Tidus would like them to ? You know, like the dead and the living in the farplane...

...What?

Are you saying that since it's Tidus' POV here, he's distorting how people are acting through bias; or that his mere presence is altering people's personalities to back when they knew him on the pilgrimage?

Sorry, but I've had some crazy ideas and headcanons regarding Tidus before, and even this is making me scratch my head a bit.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 22, 2014, 08:19:51 am
About Tidus, I have a theory : What if Tidus was making people as if they were still acting with their FFX behavior ? Or, if you prefer : What if people were acting as Tidus would like them to ? You know, like the dead and the living in the farplane...

...What?

Are you saying that since it's Tidus' POV here, he's distorting how people are acting through bias; or that his mere presence is altering people's personalities to back when they knew him on the pilgrimage?

Sorry, but I've had some crazy ideas and headcanons regarding Tidus before, and even this is making me scratch my head a bit.

Absolutely. My theory is not nonsensical and can explain a lot of things... but only Nojima can provide us the truth...
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on December 22, 2014, 02:01:09 pm
Actually Chercheur, your theory could explain a lot away. I mean think about it. The theory about the Farplane presented in the game is that when the living look at an image of the dead, the living sees what they want to see, or rather how they think the dead would react. So with Tidus' current condition, why wouldn't his perception be off? We already know he's weak and not himself in the audio drama, so maybe his view of the world is like a reverse Farplane effect.

I'd personally love to see an X-3 but I'll be honest, I think Nojima's focusing too much on this soap opera drama between Tidus and Yuna at the expense of everything else. With the entire world of Spira rapidly developing and rebuilding, there's plenty of room for greater lore expansion, new enemies, new enemies disguised as old enemies (ha!), and political tensions because let's be real, in their current state, the people of Spira are very vunerable to having another oppressive government and/or religious group roll in. There's also the supposed connection between X/X-2 and VII thats groundwork can be layed.. You get the idea.

X-3 could be a nice blend of strengthening all of the old characters while maybe introducing a couple new ones. But unfortunately, all we have so far is regression of old characters, Tidus & Yuna: A Lifetime Original Drama, and a little turd named Chuami. I'll give props to the attempt at lore expansion and if Chercheur's crazy theory is correct, then there's still hope for the other characters.   ;D


Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Pyreflies_of_MJ on December 23, 2014, 01:09:17 am
Well, you know, Square Enix didn't publish the novel in France, it is Lumen Editions (google it if you want). I wrote a good review about this novel and Square Enix read it.

About Tidus, I have a theory : What if Tidus was making people as if they were still acting with their FFX behavior ? Or, if you prefer : What if people were acting as Tidus would like them to ? You know, like the dead and the living in the farplane...


I did do a bit of digging and found about Lumen, and while Square didn't translate themselves, they at east gave Lumen the go ahead, because if there's one thing Square is serious about, it is their copyright. They will come for you if you try to make profit from their brand without their authorization, shut you down, ha ha.

I just think it's interesting, because, and someone correct me if I'm wrong - this is the first book that Square Enix has ever released that's been translated in a language besides Japanese. And of all the books they could have translated - like the Ultimania guides, they choose something most people did not like or want. XD

As far as your theory, dear Lord, how depressing that would be, Tidus gets very little dignity here. If Nojima really wrote a book about Tidus being "tainted", and negatively hallucinating the actions of everyone - what in the crap!? What a completely convoluted, annoying and unnecessary way to tell a story. That is actually and very unfortunately becoming the modus operandi of Square Enix. The more utterly ridiculous and complicated the story, the better - they really need to go back to their old form.

And well, the audio drama was mostly in the perspective of Chuami, who could plainly see Yuna acting unusual for herself. So I wouldn't say it adds up that everyone is being distorted by Tiida. The book doesn't appear to be in first-person either, which is the only way I could see the idea of distortions as a plausibility. I remember someone else saying there are a lot of perspective changes and that much of the novel is written in a Haiku format - confusing to be sure. But these opening chapters are definitely from an outside perspective looking in, so we should be experiencing the characters the way everyone else is - right?

I'm actually curious, is there at any point where we see either Tidus or Yuna's inward thoughts, in the way they delivered them in the games?




Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on December 23, 2014, 01:07:24 pm
I just think it's interesting, because, and someone correct me if I'm wrong - this is the first book that Square Enix has ever released that's been translated in a language besides Japanese. And of all the books they could have translated - like the Ultimania guides, they choose something most people did not like or want. XD

You are wrong wrong wrong.... First, Square Enix has never released a book outside Japan, not in France at least, don't try to say something which could mislead people. Then, Lumen has already released FFVII On the way to a smile, and FFXIII episode zero promise in France. I know that an other publisher has released some FF books in Germany too.

As far as your theory, dear Lord, how depressing that would be, Tidus gets very little dignity here. If Nojima really wrote a book about Tidus being "tainted", and negatively hallucinating the actions of everyone - what in the crap!? What a completely convoluted, annoying and unnecessary way to tell a story. That is actually and very unfortunately becoming the modus operandi of Square Enix. The more utterly ridiculous and complicated the story, the better - they really need to go back to their old form.

It's your opinion, not mine for sure.

And well, the audio drama was mostly in the perspective of Chuami, who could plainly see Yuna acting unusual for herself. So I wouldn't say it adds up that everyone is being distorted by Tiida. The book doesn't appear to be in first-person either, which is the only way I could see the idea of distortions as a plausibility. I remember someone else saying there are a lot of perspective changes and that much of the novel is written in a Haiku format - confusing to be sure. But these opening chapters are definitely from an outside perspective looking in, so we should be experiencing the characters the way everyone else is - right?

I don't know what Haiku is.

I'm actually curious, is there at any point where we see either Tidus or Yuna's inward thoughts, in the way they delivered them in the games?

There are some inward thoughts but too short compared with those in the games.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on December 23, 2014, 10:38:56 pm
I don't know about the XIII novels, but the VII novels got an official translation from Square, didn't they? I just know I got a copy of the novels in English when I bought the Advent Children movies. Pssh. Of course their beloved VII gets translated, but you guys have to do all the hard work of translating a X novel yourselves. Dang spoiled FFVII fans. They get it all! xD

It's a shame that they won't release the Ultimania's in English! I'd take those over a novel any day! So many interesting factoids.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Pyreflies_of_MJ on December 24, 2014, 09:43:47 am

You are wrong wrong wrong.... First, Square Enix has never released a book outside Japan, not in France at least, don't try to say something which could mislead people. Then, Lumen has already released FFVII On the way to a smile, and FFXIII episode zero promise in France. I know that an other publisher has released some FF books in Germany too.

I wasn't refuting what you were saying, my bad. I'm not trying to say that Square did the translations themselves or officially published it, just that they must have given the authorization for them to be translated by that company, I presume. That's what I mean by Square releasing it, without their approval there would be no published translations of any kind. So even though they didn't translate/publish it, they are still releasing it, in a sense. Almost like how they released this remaster, which they actually outsourced and didn't work on either. :p

I didn't know about those other things that were translated, though, interesting.

Oh, and Haiku is a traditional form of Japanese poetry that is very precise and specific about how lines are written. A certain amount of syllables must be used for each line. It seems like a rather restrictive/confusing way to write a novel, but I am no Haiku expert by any means.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Pyreflies_of_MJ on December 24, 2014, 09:48:51 am
I don't know about the XIII novels, but the VII novels got an official translation from Square, didn't they? I just know I got a copy of the novels in English when I bought the Advent Children movies. Pssh. Of course their beloved VII gets translated, but you guys have to do all the hard work of translating a X novel yourselves. Dang spoiled FFVII fans. They get it all! xD

It's a shame that they won't release the Ultimania's in English! I'd take those over a novel any day! So many interesting factoids.

Well, it wouldn't surprise me if Square was willing to do extra stuff for FFVII because they are always being extra with that game. They stayed annoying me with all the FFVII spinoffs and things, damn. And fans are still talking about wanting a remake - no, let that thing die and move on.

And God, yes, I've always wanted the Ultimania guides in English. But we will see pigs fly and hell freeze over before that happens. T_T
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Zanark on January 04, 2015, 05:13:28 pm
So ... is the translation of the novel still going or is it dead? I've been silently reading everything on these forums the past two days ... after all, this is the only place to get reliable information on the novel.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on January 05, 2015, 10:01:54 am
We're taking a break because of Christmas holidays and the exams after that. We'll resume on the 19th.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Fyire on January 16, 2015, 07:16:48 am
Hi guys, really late to the party, but I'd just like to thank you all for translating and making this accessible to us.

I've read whatever's up at the moment, and here are my two cents:

Lulu and Rikku's behaviors don't actually bother me that much. Lulu has never been a very warm and friendly person to begin with, and her insistence at Tidus going to help set up the party could be seen as her trying to assimilate Tidus back into Besaid. After all, imagine how the Besaid villagers must feel-- this guy who disappeared two years ago at the beginning of the Eternal Calm, presumed to be dead, suddenly appears alive at their beach, and he has some sort of relationship with their beloved High Summoner. I'd imagine that it would be likely that the villagers are wary of Tidus. I'd also consider how unfriendly they were towards Tidus at the beginning of FFX. Sure, not all the people on Besaid Island were unfriendly, but given that their traditional beliefs (I know, Besaid appeared to align itself with the Youth League in FFX2, but they were never all that political? The only visible representation of this is in Beclem, but even then it largely became more of a Blitzball training thing than real political alignment like the issue in Kilika) and how Tidus completely disregarded that during his brief stay in Besaid, their cautiousness around him seems likely.

Sorry, went off tangent there a little-- back to Lulu. I believe her comment regarding her marriage with Wakka was merely a joke of sorts; she does this a lot in the game as well. Rikku has also always had some sort of sibling rivalry behavior going on with Tidus, although we don't see it much. She's also very jumpy and restless. I don't think she was truly angry when she accused Tidus of not listening to her; based on her overall characterization I would say that's just how Rikku acts, which is seen throughout the course of FFX2.

The entire thing with the elders and Yuna does bother me a little, given that there didn't seem to be much of this issue throughout the entire course of FFX, X-2 and the Eternal Calm cutscenes. The only examples I can think of are perhaps the marriage proposal brought up by Wakka to Yuna during the Eternal Calm cutscenes-- in that, it sounds a lot like Wakka deals with the elders for her. I guess it's not entirely implausible that Yuna is held up by these nameless elders; sure we don't see it in the games, but Yuna does at times have this sense of apprehension at returning to Besaid in FFX2. I don't mean that in a bad way: just as she said that she 'felt like a runaway child coming home', it's almost as if she expected to be chided. Considering that she was pretty much raised by these temple elders, it would make a lot of sense that she defers a lot to them. In FFX2, apart from the mission involving the fiends coming out of Besaid temple (and in that one, everyone in the temple was evacuated, so...), there was really no other reason for Yuna to go into the  temple. Also, when Yuna was to stay over in Besaid for a night, she stayed in Lulu's house, and not the room in the temple as stated in the novel. Perhaps I'm reading into it too much, but given all the information I suppose it can be assumed that when Yuna came back to Besaid over the course of FFX2, she would avoid the temple, and by extension the elders. Hence, even if we don't see much of the elders throughout the games, it's not unlikely that they would occupy her and disallow her from interacting with Tidus.

Again, just my two cents on the controversies surrounding this entire novella-- a novel can be interpreted in so many ways, especially given how vague the Japanese language is. I'd like to believe Nojima didn't just up and decided to butcher the entire series just to create a bit more drama. I do appreciate the backstory he is fleshing out for us, although of course I haven't had a chance to read the rest of the novel yet, so... In any case, thanks so much for translating the novel once again!
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on January 16, 2015, 10:36:38 am
Hey, Fyire. Thanks for taking the time and patience to read our translations. We respect everybody's views on this novella's contents, even if some of us do get a little bit passionate. :P

However, even with these characters' defining personalties and where they stand in regards to X-2, it also brings up some confusion. Yes, Lulu may have been cold to a lot of people, especially Tidus, in the beginning of FFX, but we are left to assume that most of her disdain towards him was chalked up to him looking very similar to her late boyfriend, him seemingly having gotten a whiff of Sin's toxins leading to distrust, and the not-too-subtle chemistry between him and Yuna. But now, Lulu's moved on, marrying another man and having a child; Tidus has proven himself a sane man by technically being from Zanarkand after all; and with Yuna still alive and them being very much in love, I could see her approving of their time together if it means Yuna will be happy. I could probably see Lulu being sceptical if Tidus came back in a suspicious or coincidental-in-a-bad-way manner, but him coming back after the world has been saved by another terror, you'd think she'd be more relaxed seeing a friend who she hasn't seen in two years. Instead, she acts like Tidus is now half-cyborg or something. Just eerily cold and even displeased with him. The same could be said for Rikku.

By the way, Square is announcing a new game at the end of the month. What could it be? FFX-3? Dissidia 3? I know I've predicted this numerous times and gotten it wrong, but something tells me that maybe I just might get what I'm looking for. Could be because they're announcing Dragon Quest Theatrhythm too!
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Fyire on January 16, 2015, 12:40:11 pm
It's always great to meet fellow fans of the series!! I haven't been able to play my HD Remaster copy since it came out due to school, so I only just recently played it, and discovered the existence of the novella and the audio drama. What really bothers me is that Tidus would move to Bevelle of all places. Since he's a professional blitzball player, it would have made more sense for him to move to Luca. Bevelle isn't even close to Luca... they sure came up with a lot of loose ends with these productions.

Hmm... I'd postulate that because Lulu has always been rather pessimistic, her coldness towards Tidus could stem from her worry that he will disappear and disappoint Yuna again. She does come off as slightly standoffish, especially at the part where Tidus mentions that she has new priorities.

Perhaps it could also be, as one other user mentioned, that Tidus is an unreliable narrator to some extent. It's hard to say, really. It's clear that Tidus is more than a little shaken by how much he has missed.

I do hope we will hope a FFX-3, but with news reports it seems like Dissidia 3 is a little plausible. As long as they don't cook up another story surrounding the entire Fabula Nova Crystallis series...
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on January 16, 2015, 01:30:11 pm
However, who can say Tidus moved to Bevelle specifically for his blitzball career? My theory is that he had to leave because Besaid was getting way too pro-Yevoner for his own tastes and safety. You find out in the audio drama that it's become a reclusion for the Yevoners and Yuna became their little spokesperson. And we all know about Tidus' distrust for Yevon, even in the name. But hey, we don't know much about that aspect in the novel yet, so it's too early to conclude.

It could be a case of narrator-bias, but then again, this novel isn't entirely or specifically in first-person. Maybe they had to improvise for this French translation, but from what I've heard the narration in the original Japanese is a weird and random combination of first-person and third-person. It makes it hard to decipher what we're supposed to be feeling for Tidus. Or, well... maybe Tidus, tragically enough, isn't as welcomed on Besaid as we were led to believe at the end of X-2. Most of this novel is first/third-person view from Tidus, before switching over to Yuna at the end. In fact, judging by her strange deja vu-ish behaviour in the audio drama and what Ifarnal does to her, maybe she's the one whose narration is distorted. Or everything is symbolic. That works, right? Again, too early to conclude.

You know what I would love? A Dissidia game with the Dynasty Warriors engine; with elements of Final Fantasy peppered into it. This Dynasty Warriors trend seems to be popular nowadays with Hyrule Warriors, Gundam Warriors and One Piece: Pirate Warriors. I could really see a Dissidia Warriors working. Especially since the character roster and map sizes could almost match that of a regular Dynasty Warriors game. Heck, they could even imitate the Three Kingdoms with Cosmos' Forces, Chaos' Forces and... Neutral Forces, I guess.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on January 17, 2015, 02:31:33 pm
Hey guys ! I'm back !  :D

CrystalOfLies, why did you use "she" for the radar ?  ???  here ->  “She may have had her days,” Shinra declared. “End of the road for her.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on January 17, 2015, 03:41:08 pm
In the English language, if we refer to a piece of machinery by gender, it's usually always female.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on January 17, 2015, 05:13:52 pm
Oh, ok, I didn't know !  :)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on January 19, 2015, 04:22:14 pm
Fiuuu... The first pages of the chapter 5 were a pain in the ass...  lot of descriptions  >:(

But I will release the chapter tomorrow. Yuna is coming hehe !  :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on January 19, 2015, 04:38:23 pm
Yay! I've been clicking here everyday to see if you came off of vacation early, hehe. Totally not obsessed or anything >.>
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on January 19, 2015, 04:40:29 pm
Wait, who's Poto?! xD
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on January 19, 2015, 05:00:14 pm
Oops, sorry, it's Buddy in english !  ;D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Fyire on January 20, 2015, 01:00:15 pm
Ah, it just seemed a little odd to me that Tidus would move to Bevelle, of all places... Yeah, I'm hoping they will address that in the novel.

I would actually really love a FFX movie, something like Advent Children Complete! To be honest, I'm not a huge fan of the Dynasty Warriors engine... while the fights do look epic, they aren't as in depth or as fun as it is in Dissidia. The Dissidia fights are actually some of my favs! I'm really curious as to who they will include in a new Dissidia roster.

I'm really excited for the rest of the novel! The reviews are terrible, but I just can't feel at ease without knowing exactly how bad it will be.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on January 20, 2015, 01:39:48 pm
So... my WTF factor for Tidus as a character has increased tenfold with the ending for this chapter. You'll see what I mean.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on January 20, 2015, 02:01:46 pm
Haha ! ;D But remember that the passage in the bed is skipped ! I don't know what happened. :P

Anyway, the next chapter deals with Valm ! Yeah !  :D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on January 20, 2015, 02:06:18 pm
No, not that. In fact, back when a dodgy translation was leaked, the fact that Tidus just outright ignored the storm and put them at the risk of shipwrecking was an even bigger issue to the posters than the implied sexy times.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on January 20, 2015, 02:17:05 pm
Oh, that... well... yeah he's crazy but... isn't it minor compared to what they have experienced since their first meeting two years ago ?  :)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on January 20, 2015, 02:27:16 pm
It's not even the physical risk that's the main problem. We all know that Tidus, as Yuna's guardian and lover, would never try to put her in any danger of harm, let alone death. A good... let's say quarter of the entire game was Tidus and Rikku trying to find a way to stop Yuna from sacrificing herself. And all those times before, where he went so far as to break tradition just to check if she's safe should give us the impression that he'd even wrestle a behemoth to death if it even came close to Yuna.

So for him to suddenly forget all his knowledge of piloting a ship, and disregard the right-in-plain-sight storm that might kill them in a worst-case scenario just because of a perfume... doesn't that seem really off to you?
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Fyire on January 20, 2015, 02:43:42 pm
That was very out of character to me as well... I mean, I get that it's been 2 years and all, but after boasting about his experience with houseboats? And to think Yuna is the one suggesting they should place anchor.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on January 20, 2015, 02:45:04 pm
uh... Tidus didn't suddently forget all his knowledge, he just remembered. Anyway, that's Yuna who left the cove with the boat, not Tidus. So I don't really understand what you wanted to say here.

About him disregarding the right-in-plain-sight storm that might kill them, It's true Tidus was overprotective toward Yuna before... but he had a duty to fulfill ! His relation with Yuna was Guardian / Summoner above all else. Of course, his love for Yuna was an important factor, but now there are only lovers, his mind tells him : "It's ok now, indulge yourself." He's a boy after all.

But I understand your point of view.  :)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on January 21, 2015, 12:29:37 pm
I will release the next chapter tomorrow, I like translating when it comes to Valm's and Kush's story !  :D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on January 21, 2015, 12:33:16 pm
And there's a surge of guests on the forum again.

I don't know how this is happening, but it's pretty scary.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on January 21, 2015, 12:41:38 pm
Scary ?  ;D

Well, someone must have told people about the translation.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on January 21, 2015, 04:13:29 pm
I could deal with Tidus ignoring it, but Yuna does, too? Tidus has been known to make rash decisions before (though, not usually ones that endanger Yuna) but Yuna is usually a lot more level-headed, and is generally a voice of reason? You would think she would say, "I don't knoooooow. That storm looks pretty bad..." But no. She's just gonna... drive right into it. Oooookay. I guess maybe she trusted him when he said he knew what he was doing...???

I suppose it's not entirely impossible the two are just too caught up in their reunion to think clearly. But... meh. Just another notch of questionable characterization to add to the novel... sigh.

But I'm glad that otherwise, Yuna seems to be acting more like herself!!!

Looking forward to the next chapter!
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on January 22, 2015, 10:42:28 am
I'm done with the chapter 6!  :D

The first time I read it, it was so confusing. But now that I know everything about this novel, it's very easy to understand.  ;D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on January 22, 2015, 12:21:47 pm
What the problem with s-n-i-g-g-e-r-e-d" ?  ???

I had to write some "-".
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on January 25, 2015, 09:32:19 am
Hey ! I'm currently translating the chapter 8 and I'm starting to ask myself about contractions, like "don't" for example. No one reproached me for not doing them. Would you like me to write them in the dialogues from now on ? I started not to write them because it's a novel and I don't really know if it was the right choice. Thanks.  :)

PS : Since Kush talks with dignity, I will never write the contractions in her dialogues.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Fyire on January 25, 2015, 10:16:23 am
I think contractions would be nice! It would sound more like the way they are scripted in the games.

Anyway, the backstory is getting more and more interesting. I'm really anxious to see where they are going with the whole Kush story.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on January 25, 2015, 01:52:46 pm
fiuu, I'm done with the chapter, 8 pages in one day, I'm crazy ! ;D

Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on January 25, 2015, 02:25:13 pm
Yeah, in English, there's nothing wrong with contractions, especially in dialogue! unless the person speaking is a very proper person who wouldn't use contractions, like Kush! but almost everyone uses them nowadays, haha, even fancy fancy people xD

 Some people will refrain from using them in the narrative, when people AREN'T speaking, but it really just depends on the style the novel is written in... but this one seems to be written somewhat informally, so I don't think there would be anything wrong with using contractions!

But really, it's up to you and doesn't bother me either way...

I'm taking the dialogue of the characters somewhat loosely, because it's very hard to translate twice over and keep it in character without spending ages re-writing, I would imagine! So i'm more so just absorbing the meaning of what they're saying, rather than analyzing the exact words being spoken, you know? 

And good job on the fast translating! :D the book is flying by!
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on January 25, 2015, 03:05:24 pm
Finally, I have decided to use contractions in the dialogues only.

... This has nothing to do with the topic but did someone watch the beginning of the third episode of Unlimited Fafnir (anime) ? I thought I was watching the Mushroom Rock battle :o
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on January 27, 2015, 01:41:14 pm
Tomorrow... Chapter 9 !  ;)

Nothing great except for Lulu's and Bria's conversation at the end... huhu...
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on January 28, 2015, 03:17:00 pm
This Bria dude's getting creepier and creepier..
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on January 28, 2015, 07:04:45 pm
And that's not all... You'll see... Poor Shinra  ::)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Light_Fury on January 29, 2015, 09:22:33 am
I did not understand the meaning of the conversation between Bria and Lulu. Who was the predecessor of Bria?
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on January 29, 2015, 09:49:10 am
Certainly a monk.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Light_Fury on January 29, 2015, 10:17:05 am
ah ok, I thought it was a character already known
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on January 29, 2015, 10:24:43 am
Light_Fury, Bria seems to be worming his way into a position of power in Besaid supposedly under the authorization of this suspicious "Neo-Yevon Church" Lulu can sense this, which is why when he makes a comment about how Wakka is in charge rather that himself, she cuts to the chase and asks him why he's in Besaid. Bria gives her reasons that sound like total BS and then she comments that his predecessor is missing and people can hear a dead unsent/fiend wandering around repeating Bria's name (as if the unsent's seeking revenge for being wrongfully murdered) Bria then attempts to shut her down by telling Lulu that when people see those monsters, they often hallucinate. The convo ends with him asking her who witnessed this fiend, she replies that it was herself. Long story short, Bria killed a guy and Lulu knows it. Hope this helps :)

ChercheurObscur, NOOOO,I love Shinra!!!!!
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Light_Fury on January 29, 2015, 10:47:29 am
Then Bria is an impostor? He is a guy who talks too much to have a clear conscience  ;D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on January 30, 2015, 03:59:00 pm
The next chapter is quite long, I think I will release it monday or tuesday.

But this chapter is quite interesting, quite a lot of new information... Valm, Kush, maybe a new character...  ;)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on February 02, 2015, 02:02:11 pm
In the end, I will release the chapter tomorrow.

From now on, the chapters are quite long (10-20 pages), so you'll have to be patient.  :P

EDIT : I'm done with the chapter ! Enjoy !  :D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on February 03, 2015, 04:07:58 pm
Well, I know multiple posts are not good, but I'm the admin so... no just kidding ! But since there's not a lot of people on this forum, you will gladly accept it, right ?  :P

So, I wanted to talk about Kush and this sentence : "They will go to hell", she said lightly. -> This woman is so wonderful, I mean I laughed when I read this sentence whereas the situation is really bad, creepy sometimes, etc. I really appreciate the character, she is so gentle, frail, dignified... but so direct sometimes. I do like this character ! I hope to see her in the potential FFX-3 !  :D


... But at the end... poor Kush...  :(
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on February 03, 2015, 05:15:15 pm
She's very interesting! Maybe it's because I just finished catching up on the books, but something about her reminds me a lot of Arianne Martell from ASOIAF/Game of Thrones, haha.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on February 07, 2015, 10:31:51 am
I don't watch Game of Thrones =P

Anyway, I think everyone will like the next chapter, because Tidus and Yuna are... well you'll see soon :)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on February 07, 2015, 09:08:49 pm
Is this the chapter where Tidus gets his head blown off? :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on February 08, 2015, 07:47:38 am
Is this the chapter where Tidus gets his head blown off? :P

Not at all ! You'll see the great guardian Tidus ! :)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on February 10, 2015, 01:23:58 pm
I'm done with the chapter ! Fiiuuu...

I hope you're not eating right now !  ::)

Also, the next chapter is very long, don't expect it soon !  :-\ (But this chapter is soooo gooood !)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on February 10, 2015, 02:17:41 pm
...Oh my, Tidus.

Am I noticing parallels being drawn between these two and Valm and Kushu? :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on February 10, 2015, 02:51:46 pm
...Oh my, Tidus.

Am I noticing parallels being drawn between these two and Valm and Kushu? :P

Yes, you are ! :)

In the next chapter, Valm's and Kush's story is about to come to an end... one of the best chapters of the book.

PS: COL, if you want, you can do the contractions in the first chapters during the conversations between the characters (but Kush).
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on February 18, 2015, 02:30:32 pm
Hey guys ! I know everyone is waiting for the next chapter ! So I've planned to release it this week-end ! YEAH !  :D
This chapter is really oppressive, nothing good comes of it, always bad news...  ::)

Anyway, to keep up with the translation, I bought myself the necklace of Yuna in FFX-2 !  :D It's so pretty that I succumbed to temptation !  ;D

(http://img4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20130529141129/finalfantasy/images/8/87/Yuna-Necklace.JPG)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on February 18, 2015, 08:11:17 pm
Yay, depressing chapters! xD

But I've always loved Yuna's jewelry!! The necklace is so gorgeous. It's been sort of a headcanon of mine that it was a gift from her parents... and in a way sort of represents their family, with the 2 petals being them and her the large flower. Her name means hibiscus in Japanese, too, so I think it has a lot of symbolism, hehe. REGARDLESS, it's a beautiful necklace!! I want to get one, but I'm afraid I'd never wear it because it's so delicate, haha. I have Tidus' necklace which I wear sometimes if I feel particularly nerdy that day. xD
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on February 19, 2015, 11:55:30 am
Furthermore, the aquamarine stone in its centre has a deep signification !

Anyway, maybe you'll have something to read tonight, I'm quite full of spirit right now...  ;D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on February 19, 2015, 02:36:38 pm
I'm done !  :D

I'm expecting some reactions from you guys you know, this chapter is like a bloodbath...
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on February 19, 2015, 05:34:01 pm
Thanks again Chercheur! How many more chapters are there to go?
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on February 19, 2015, 06:12:02 pm
Thanks again Chercheur! How many more chapters are there to go?

You're welcome ! Well, there are 34 chapters so something like 22 remaining chapters. But I think it's better to look at the number of remaining pages which is approximately 150. I translated 120 pages approximately until now.


CrystalOfLies : you fixed a sentence here : "  “Be quiet!” Valm intimidated them  " but I think you're wrong, I used initially the verb "intimate" which means "to tell with authority" like a call to order. the verb "intimidate" doesn't really have the same meaning, am I right ? And isn't it odd to use "intimidate" in this case ? I don't think it makes sense  in terms of grammar ?
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on February 20, 2015, 07:31:44 am
Hiya!

I have been reading the translation since Chapter 1 and this last one left me so intrigued that I have to ask this!

Is the "Mage of Zanarkand" actually Yu Yevon?
It is mentioned in the book that "the Mage of Zanarkand, his daughter and his followers" are heretics and such... Does this mean the the Mage is Yu Yevon and his daughter Yunalesca? They were summoners, after all, and Yu Yevon was said to be peerless in that he was extremely powerful, moreso than the other summoners.

Another thing that ground my gears is the fact that, in this book, Bevelle seems to be using summoners whilst Zanarkand is using weapons. Wasn't it the other way around as stated in the games? Bahamut's fayth said that the summoners of Zanarkand didn't stand a chance against Bevelle's weapons, that's why Yu Yevon created that multitude of the fayth and summoned Zanarkand anew before creating Sin, destroying the original Zanarkand and browbeating Bevelle into spreading his teachings. Unless the Bedohls created weapons so powerful that they overpowered Zanarkand's? It's so confusing.  :-\

Does this also mean that Zanarkand created fayth the way we see them in FFX, since Yunalesca used Zaon to create his fayth that way, whilst Bevelle used aeon cores, like Ifarnal, Kush and the other summoners? Is that why the aeon core method practically vanished from history after the Machina War?

I liked this book! :)
Until now, it has nothing of the BS people had been saying, and it has raised a few questions that I'm making now!
Unfortunately, we're not having FFX-3 so soon.. :( Bummer.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on February 20, 2015, 10:59:29 am
I believe realistically, both Bevelle and Zanarkand would have weapons, since Zanarkand was a flourishing machina city; it wouldn't make sense for them to just use magic and summoners when they are also very technologically advanced.

However, Bevelle had the Bedohls, which could potentially be very dangerous suits of armour. They probably had the power to fight and create even more dangerous weapons, since these are pretty much the ancestors of the Al Bhed, which are machina whizzes.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on February 20, 2015, 03:12:22 pm
Does this mean that Bevelle's weapons were similar to those used on Operation Mi'ihen and Home?
The Bedohls' creator, Alb, didn't seem to have any qualms on how they were used as tools of war; it seems really unfair that they apparently took the blame for the war and were considered outcasts, thus all the preconception regarding the Al Bhed seen on FFX.
It also seemed for me that Alb tricked everyone into thinking they were robots, when they were actually genetically-engineered (right?) humans operating machines. Why was this? Just because he was a sadist? Or did he have any ulterior motives?
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on February 20, 2015, 06:49:33 pm
Know that Alb is just the name of a divinity. In fact, Alb is the divinity of workers. So the Alb who lived in the base is not the creator of the Bedohls. He just took on its name as others could do. The Bedohls are a race which "developped" in society thanks to their gift in the field of mechanics (explosive for example. Bria says it to Tidus at the end of the novel).

But they were forced to do that else they were killed. So Zanarkand or any government could use them to build machines or weapons for example.

In the case of the base in Besaid, the Alb there was apparently the one forced. He had to create mechanical Bedohls but for a reason I don't know, he couldn't do it and tried to run away. But you have a point about the fact that Alb could have tricked the Bedohls in a weird way because they were moving on their own very strangely just before Alb ran away...

Also, I think some of you have misunderstood the origin of the name "Al Bhed". It comes from the DIVINITY "Alb" and the race "Bedohl". I might have said something wrong in the file "1000 years ago" about this point... sorry.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on February 21, 2015, 11:55:36 am
Oh, I see.
But Valm seemed to think the Bedohls were just robots, when they were in fact humans. It's shown when he cuts a Bedohl's hand off and it starts gushing blood, he says it's "too realistic" and asked him to remove the blood or change its color. So, since Alb couldn't create mechanical Bedohls properly, he just spread the word that the human Bedohls were mechanical and was just teaching them how to fight and sent them to the front lines. So when Valm entered Alb's workshop and saw the Bedohls helping their injured comrades, he realized that they were actually human and that there were actually much fewer robots than Alb claimed there were. This could explain why Valm pitied them, even though he hated their guts.

EDIT: May I translate the novel to Portuguese? I own a FF Facebook page for my fellow Brazilian fans and, considering I'm responsible for lore and theory content, I feel like bringing this sort of content to them is constructive to the fanbase. I'll give due credit, of course. :)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on February 22, 2015, 12:07:12 pm
EDIT: May I translate the novel to Portuguese? I own a FF Facebook page for my fellow Brazilian fans and, considering I'm responsible for lore and theory content, I feel like bringing this sort of content to them is constructive to the fanbase. I'll give due credit, of course. :)

Of course ! :)


EDIT : About the next chapter, you'll find it very strange at the end... I have not managed to understand it yet.  ???
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on February 25, 2015, 05:12:32 pm
Done with the chapter !  :)

The next one will bring Valm's and Kush's story to an end... I hope you're not sad.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on February 26, 2015, 11:18:56 am
Valm and Kush's story is far more interesting than Tidus and Yuna's so far, even though a parallel was drawn between them: the dedicated, loving guardian and the ever-so-obedient summoner.
By the way, how come Valm had children? Did he have them with Kush? Or did he meet her after becoming a father? Because it makes no sense for an unsent to have children: they are just drifting souls who want to finish their business before going to the Farplane.

And the story seems to tell us that Ifarnal was a dick, who picked this name because it's the 'god of beauty' and that he always tried to look cool and seduce people around. He was even unable to keep a summoning because he couldn't bond with his fayth.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on February 26, 2015, 12:25:19 pm
By the way, how come Valm had children? Did he have them with Kush? Or did he meet her after becoming a father? Because it makes no sense for an unsent to have children: they are just drifting souls who want to finish their business before going to the Farplane.

No, he had children with a beautiful woman who... well it's difficult to explain, she liked those names Bria (Valm) had told her (Anli's eye for example). (But at that time, Yevon had already disowned (renounced ?) those names) There is a dedicated chapter about his past which is very interesting. But you'll have to wait a bit. Anyway, they had a child for sure.

And the story seems to tell us that Ifarnal was a dick, who picked this name because it's the 'god of beauty' and that he always tried to look cool and seduce people around. He was even unable to keep a summoning because he couldn't bond with his fayth.

Yeah... well you know, he was young :) He regrets a bit what happened at that time.

Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on February 26, 2015, 04:18:01 pm
No, he had children with a beautiful woman who... well it's difficult to explain, she liked those names Bria (Valm) had told her (Anli's eye for example). (But at that time, Yevon had already disowned (renounced ?) those names) There is a dedicated chapter about his past which is very interesting. But you'll have to wait a bit. Anyway, they had a child for sure.
But.. he was an unsent by then  :o it makes little to no sense

Yeah... well you know, he was young :) He regrets a bit what happened at that time.
He reminded me of Bickson, that Luca Goers guy who belittled everyone because he was oh-so-awesome just for being in the Luca Goers.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on February 26, 2015, 04:30:05 pm
No, he had children with a beautiful woman who... well it's difficult to explain, she liked those names Bria (Valm) had told her (Anli's eye for example). (But at that time, Yevon had already disowned (renounced ?) those names) There is a dedicated chapter about his past which is very interesting. But you'll have to wait a bit. Anyway, they had a child for sure.
But.. he was an unsent by then  :o it makes little to no sense

Well, Maybe his wish was to find love and live a happy life ? At that time, he did not remember Kush but I think he had still inside him the wish to love someone ?

Yeah... well you know, he was young :) He regrets a bit what happened at that time.
He reminded me of Bickson, that Luca Goers guy who belittled everyone because he was oh-so-awesome just for being in the Luca Goers.

Yeah, and he's red-haired too ! :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on February 28, 2015, 11:51:09 am
Done with the chapter !

Oh, and "Tidus" section is complete now. It is called "Boy's side" in the previous topic.

The next chapter is the beginning of "Yuna" section, called "Girl's side" in the previous topic.

EDIT : oops, my bad, I said something wrong. Just remember "Tidus" section is complete.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on March 08, 2015, 09:49:58 am
...wait, really? I thought they were going to explain what REALLY saved Tidus and Yuna. I figured Tidus had to be hallucinating. Please tell me it wasn't actually a giant underwater Jecht... surely they're going to explain this later...
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on March 08, 2015, 10:16:36 am
I felt like that, too... "Dafuq is happening here?" Then again, it could be effect of the magic surrounding the summoned island...
What I think is odd is how Ifarnal kept the summoning if he couldn't bond properly with the fayth, for how long he has been doing it and why. If it has really been 1000 years since the summoning, I figure he'd dwindle like Yu Yevon, who was said to be peerless when alive yet he ultimately succumbed because he was drawing immensurable power from an uncountable number of fayth as well. Unless, of course, if Ifarnal's fayth are all Aeon Cores instead, then I can't really say because it hasn't been stated yet how this method of creating fayth strains the body and mind of the summoner.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on March 08, 2015, 12:10:30 pm
Didn't Tidus say earlier in the book that his dad saved him from drowning when he was a kid? I just assumed he was hallucinating that, but idk....I wouldn't be surprise if it's an underwater Jecht with no explaination. Remember, this book is a set-up book for any potential game or whatever they might release later so it's not going to be complete on its own.

Have any of you read/watched Harry Potter? Maybe creating Aeon Cores is kind of like when Voldemort creates a Horcrux and it drains, deforms, and splits his soul up.. Just a guess though.

Btw, how do you use a sphere as sunblock? That's the ultimate question.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on March 08, 2015, 04:50:03 pm
As a matter of fact, yeah, I've read HP... But if creating Aeon Cores really took a toll on the summoner, how come Ifarnal seems to be alright, just older than the late teens he was when he was alive? Because he said that he summoned the island using hundreds of fayth. I'm just.. what the hell.

Perhaps he was hallucinating and that was just side-effects of the magic surrounding the summoned island. Like Yevon, Ifarnal may have not wanted his island to be discovered, or at least not by just anyone who passed by it either by boat, airship or swimming. Perhaps it let Tidus pass because of his origins as a summon, or because he hails from Zanarkand, who knows.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Akuwah on March 10, 2015, 08:14:24 am
When you're at the sea isolated, extremely tired/fatigued and dehydrated even, you can experience hallucinations so I'm pretty sure Tidus was just hallucinating

Spoiler (hover to show)

 ;D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on March 16, 2015, 11:14:50 am
When you're at the sea isolated, extremely tired/fatigued and dehydrated even, you can experience hallucinations so I'm pretty sure Tidus was just hallucinating

Spoiler (hover to show)

 ;D


Rofl

Question time!

Since it's now established that both Bevelle and Zanarkand had summoners, is it safe to assume that Bevelle considered Zanarkand's summoners heretics for not following their divinities, but Yu Yevon instead? The "Mage of Zanarkand" that they fight so fervently against, is that Yu Yevon? It seems to fit, since it's said that he has a daughter and hundreds of followers: he is the Mage, with Yunalesca being the daughter.
It makes sense, since Bevelle's old summoners seem to follow different ways than those of Zanarkand: they adopt their divinities' names and call forth the aeon cores' power to summon; whilst Zanarkand's summoners retain their birth names and use the fayth we saw on FFX, directly opposing Bevelle's ways and this could probably be an inciting factor to start the Machina War.

Btw, isn't it curious that everything shady/dark/nasty/whatever about Spira is related to Bevelle? Their use of machina was blamed for Sin's apparition, they made use of torture and subjugation to hide their past and coerce the summoners into advancing to the front lines, that's where **** happened in FFX, they hid Vegnagun under their depths, Trema took the spheres documenting Spira's past there to destroy them... One could say that Bevelle alludes to Pandora's Box due to all this ****.

EDIT: Why was Kush unwilling to send Valm to the Farplane, and why did she not let Ifarnal do it? I didn't get it either.. :(
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Light_Fury on March 26, 2015, 03:57:44 pm
But.....and the chapter n. 17? I can't wait!
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on March 27, 2015, 02:43:13 pm
But.....and the chapter n. 17? I can't wait!

Unfortunately, you won't be able to read it before... the end of may (approximately). Remember that translating this novel takes a lot of time and I'm doing it for free. But I'm currently busy with severals projects (studies), and Final Fantasy Type-0 HD. So you'll have to wait until I'm done with all of this (and my exams in may).

I've not forgotten the translation, don't worry :)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Light_Fury on March 28, 2015, 06:29:05 am
Don't worry, I didn't want be stressful. Thank you very much for your work  ;)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on May 20, 2015, 03:19:16 pm

Time has passed... but I'm back everyone !  :D

Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on May 21, 2015, 04:44:16 am
Yaaay!  :D Welcome back! Hope your schooling went well!
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on May 21, 2015, 04:48:31 am
All right! I can't wait until we get to the point with the blitzball bomb!
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on May 21, 2015, 04:18:31 pm
Yaaay!  :D Welcome back! Hope your schooling went well!
It went well ! Well, sometimes, it was difficult but I managed to stick it out. :)

All right! I can't wait until we get to the point with the blitzball bomb!

It's very close now ! Please be excited ! :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on May 24, 2015, 02:13:56 pm
I'm done with the chapter !

The next chapter is the long-awaited one ! Poor Tidus !  ::)

Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on May 26, 2015, 12:08:51 pm
Chapter 16 up!

I have to say, Yuna's being a bit of a jerk.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on May 26, 2015, 01:51:43 pm
Yuna's just fulfilling a jrpg trope. Now that she's more assertive, she must also be a jerk. I never noticed tropes like this until I played a couple of jrpgs.. Now they just stick out like sore thumbs. :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on May 26, 2015, 02:56:53 pm
Hey ! Just here to say I won't be able to translate the novel until saturday, so don't expect any progress until then :)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on May 26, 2015, 03:25:23 pm
I do know that that happens with most of the assertive female characters in JRPGs (heck, look at Chuami), but I feel like it's a... little out-of-place for Yuna's character? She was still pretty kind in X-2.

Maybe this translates to that big rumour that came out with the novella; that Yuna was getting really annoyed at him and just keeps on rejecting his attempts at romance. Especially her response to their nearly drowning at the beginning of this chapter. That was pretty mean-spirited, even for her.

Once all the novella's translated I'm probably going to write a review on it.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on May 27, 2015, 03:16:11 am
Actually, I'll be busy only next week. So you'll be able to read the 17th chapter this week.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on May 27, 2015, 10:03:17 am
I actually have exams next week, so I'll probably be busy.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on May 27, 2015, 04:00:28 pm
I think her behavior is pretty out there for Yuna, but I'm wondering if it's just lost in translation from Japanese to English-- not that you aren't doing a great job translating, but like, maybe the way she is speaking just doesn't translate well over to English? Because after everything that happened in X and after the development she goes through in X-2, I can completely see Yuna scolding him for being careless and sacrificing his own welfare for hers... it's just... the way she said it seems uncharacteristically harsh. And a lot of her little remarks... I can't tell if their teasing/joking or if she's actually annoyed. So I wonder if she's more concerned and playful in Japanese but when we translate it it sounds rude???

I don't know... I'm probably giving Nojima too much benefit of the doubt. He probably just cares more about making her wear bikinis than maintaining her character :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on May 27, 2015, 04:08:33 pm
It's made even worse for me; I have a hard time detecting sarcasm, so when I'm proofreading I can't tell if she's being playful or actually critical of him. I want to believe it's the former, but this coupled with a lot of those Japanese reviews complaining about Yuna's cruel nature...

I'm starting to give up with making sense out of all of this as well. I'm like, 'Oh, but this has to have meaning, right? It has to be part of the story, right?' but then I realised how ridiculous and convoluted it all sounds. :P It's starting to become less like a story and more like both Nojima wanting to make Yuna his jerkwad, fanservice waifu; and finding a way to kick Tidus out of the story completely.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on May 27, 2015, 05:50:11 pm
If translation is to blame, then it would be the fault of whoever translated this book from Japanese to French for incorrectly relaying the mood and intention of what they're saying. Translating from French to English wouldn't really have this problem since both languages and the way we communicate are very similar.  ;)

I kinda read it as Yuna just being anxious about being in a foreign land.. Idk
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on May 28, 2015, 07:13:41 am
I wonder why I'm the only one who thinks nothing's wrong with them.

I mean, think carefully. Tidus and Yuna have been in love with each other for only... let's say... 1 week ? 2 years have passed but you can't really take into account this.

Then while they were fighting Sin, there was a powerful link between them : Tidus' first goal was to protect and save Yuna from a cruel destiny, and Yuna was very concerned about it.

Therefore it's not like they have lived together in perfect harmony until now, it was just something like... a coincidence ?

Now people live peacefully and Tidus and Yuna meet again. But there's no more link like guardian and summoner, and while Yuna has grown up and has more or less matured, Tidus has remained a "scatty" person.

So right now, we have a brand new couple with two different traits, and they just have difficulty in matching these traits. They are just discovering each other like a real couple.

That's why I thing nothing's wrong there.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on May 28, 2015, 08:46:14 am
But I think we have to take into consideration that the time they spent together in the game can't really equate to the time they spent in the actual story. Braska's pilgrimage was said to have taken three months. Meanwhile, Yuna's pilgrimage had a lot more problems with Operation Mi'ihen, Seymour and all, so it could have taken even longer. Tidus' personality changes a lot by the end as compared to the beginning; can that really happen in the course of a week? The events we actually see must be a condensed version to fit in with the pacing of the actual game. It's likely that Tidus and Yuna had a lot more moments that we didn't see.

And the thing with Tidus' personality in this novel is that it kind of contradicts the theme from the first game, that is Tidus maturing and becoming a man in his own right. But even then, I imagine that he would pretty 'out there,' considering that he miraculously came back to life because of the woman that he loves. You seem to be implying that this is a flaw. The thing about Tidus is that he's supposed to be someone you can relate to and think realistically of as a young adult. He's not supposed to be the generic voice of reason, who must always be in the right and act like absolutely everyone else who conforms to this reasoning. And I think that this is what the novella is forgetting, considering how it's written.

I think you're giving the novella the benefit of the doubt too much. Even I'm starting to get lost with what it's trying to portray, and I consider myself an FFX fangirl. :P We all try to defend the things we love. I've even done it myself with FFX's characters way too much, but we must all admit that nothing is perfect. Everything has flaws, including this novella.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on May 28, 2015, 10:27:09 am
I agree with everything you've said, Crystal. It's the point most of us have been making since the beginning of this; the characters just seem off. The good news is that it could all be creatively fixed in FFX-3 especially since a full game would have a team of writers, instead of just Nojima. I'm wondering if this isn't part of the problem. The first 2 games had multiple writers, where as this novel is specifically written by Nojima.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on May 28, 2015, 10:44:40 am
Exactly. Even though the writing team was helmed by Nojima for both games, he most likely was under supervision by the directing team and the other writers. Since this novella is his own independent work, he has as much freedom as he wants with these characters. And I feel like he either isn't using their full potential or is even disagreeing with how they're portrayed in the games.

There's this old rumour floating around in FFX's development as a whole that Nojima proposed darker, more depressing factors to the story. One of the most famous being that Tidus was going to be an Unsent. This was shot down due to The Sixth Sense coming out at the time of FFX's development. Now that Nojima has a hold of these characters, it could be possible that this novella is a sort of 'revenge' towards the FFX team for not always getting his way in the story. Tidus is technically an Unsent now, after all.

Or it could be, as I've recently theorised, that this novella and the audio drama is all just... a big publicity stunt to get people interested in the HD Remasters. And to just get FFX into the gaming community's minds again. Unless they do something at an E3 event or one of their own events, this novella and the audio drama aren't really going to amount to anything other than controversy and Square Enix-brand trolling.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on May 28, 2015, 11:58:06 am
Well, it's just that I think that it's not because someone seems to act seriously to resolve something that he has necessarily matured. And that's what I wanted to show about Tidus with Sin, guardians and summoners... and without. And what's funny is that we can see this change of mind depending on whether he talks about Sin, Yevon... or something else (the 16th chapter shows that).

But aside from that, it's not like I disagree with you. You're right, I'll stop defending them if everything goes wrong, but I have some hope there.  :P

And when the entire novel will be translated, I think you'll change a bit your mind about all this talk between Tidus and Yuna (there's a link with Ifahnal)   ;)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on May 29, 2015, 03:24:18 pm
I'm done with the long-awaited chapter !  :D

But you'll be able to read it only if COL is not busy.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on May 29, 2015, 07:14:14 pm
bahahahahahahahah oh my gosh wtf, wtf, WTF?! Sorry, I just couldn't take this chapter seriously. Wow...  :D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on May 30, 2015, 03:57:48 am
For real! One moment we're pointing out Yuna's blatant fanservice and then bam, Headless Tidus.

Man, with every chapter I'm just feeling more and more sorry for him.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on May 30, 2015, 05:39:16 am
Haha ! Well, I feel sorry for him too there. But as you can see with this chapter, Tidus has not really matured.

Are you sure this was the aim of Square Enix with FFX ?
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on May 30, 2015, 05:52:10 am
Still, even if Tidus is portrayed as not being 'manly,' he really doesn't deserve all the stuff that's happened to him. I find it worrying that he's comparing himself to Auron of all people. He's just being a giddy teenager versus a previously heavily-religious teenager.

That Yuna has always thought of him as a child? Maybe. Still, what a detriment and a complete twist to her character. Their different outlooks on life was never a problem to their relationship in FFX, so why now?

I wish Pyreflies_Of_MJ was still around; I'd love to see her views on all of this, but alas. :(
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on May 30, 2015, 06:13:08 am
Well, I would say that's because Sin, guardians and summoners are no more. Tidus and Yuna were fighting for the same purpose at that time. I'm repeating myself here, but they were fighting like a guardian and a summoner above all else, not like a couple. Their conversations, their minds... they were certainly different at that time.

Now, they live like a couple above all else, that changes everything in my opinion. Furthermore, Yuna want to stay close to Yevon, but Tidus disagree. It doesn't help to calm the situation.

So, I'm not sure about Yuna's real traits, but am I wrong with what I've said ?  ???

But it's true that the events come one after another very quickly, and I admit this is disturbing.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on May 30, 2015, 02:10:42 pm
Tidus' portrayal doesn't bother me. He's 17 after all. I think, like in the game, in this novel he sometimes is totally immature, but then at other times, he shows his maturity. I think the novel should have a bit MORE maturity, considering everything he's gone through and how much character development he underwent in X, but whatever. I can live with it. :p

However, I absolutely find the idea that Yuna thinks he's being a 'child' and that it's a source of annoyance for her to be ridiculous. In X, it seems like so much of the reason she fell in love with him was because of how light-hearted he was. I understand that the circumstances were different in X, and that she needed him to be more childlike then because the darkness of her pilgrimage. BUT, in X-2, she herself becomes much more childlike and free-spirited, inspired partially by him. (I think Rikku, too, but also him!) So, what's the problem? Why, in a matter of days, has she gone from loving and even admiring those traits of his, to being annoyed by them? Sure, absense makes the heart fonder, but... Yuna seems like practically the most accepting person in the world, in both games. She almost never says or thinks a bad thing about a single person in the games, from what we see. Why is she suddenly so judgemental???

That whole thing feels so fabricated JUST for the sake of having relationship conflict, in my opinion. Why do this when there's plenty of other, less stupid things they could be arguing over. :p

Like, I can totally see Yuna's support of Yevon and her compulsive need to involve herself in Spira's well-being (even if it means ignoring her own personal wants, like, spending time with him) as a source of conflict for them! I think they were onto something with that. But this??? No. >_>
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on May 30, 2015, 03:11:58 pm
Exactly. I'm not bothered by Tidus' portrayal all that much, but Yuna's is a real shock for me. She can even be considered unlikeable.

She dressed similarly to him with her Gunner dressphere and even mimicked his battle stance with her Warrior one. His outspoken and rash quotes inspired her to become a sphere hunter and go on a journey for herself. She recalls all their times together, even practically acting like him... and now she's being all like, "Hmph! He did this and that, and won't even do this or that! He's being so optimistic! What a child!" She's a bit of a hypocrite to be honest. :P

Everybody can say, "Oh, but this is part of the story! It'll all make sense later on! You just don't get it and you judge too quickly!" But that's exactly it. It's like Nojima is just creating all this contrived drama to stir up a ruckus, and then passing it off as 'plot' to excuse himself. It's a completely convoluted way of telling a story. I know Spira is known for its deep lore but this is just silly. Next you'll be telling me that this novella isn't in chronological order.

Do you know why I loved the TidusYuna dynamic so much? It's because their relationship didn't have this drama that is scattered throughout the book. I thought it was very sweet how they just got along, admired each other and taught each other without any of these 'buts' and 'I wishes'. It's meant to be a fantasy story after all, and I thought the notion that they were complete opposites and were created for one another was adorable. It's a literal 'When the Sun met the Moon' relationship.

I thought Nojima would at least tribute this, considering that we spent one game building up their love and another trying to reunite them. But no. I can't feel the romance anywhere in this story. Tidus gets ditched, later on she tells him that she's going to follow Yevon again then they get washed up. Tidus is feeling lonely and is trying to 'regain her confidence' while Yuna seems completely oblivious or uncaring, suddenly judging every little thing he does. They feel more like acquaintances that were forced to work together rather than a couple.

This is a complete change to the formula. A sudden one without any explanation; it was established as soon as the novella started. As a long-time fan of the FFX universe I feel like this novella (and by extent the audio drama) isn't thanking me for being a fan, but rather slapping me in the face and mocking me for being one. But hey, it's just my opinion. And I'm getting worked up again.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on May 30, 2015, 03:55:56 pm
I do like the idea of them having conflict, because irl, couples fight, and I love realistic relationships... but I don't want that conflict to be at the expense of their characters, either! If they weren't getting along for reasons that actually made SENSE, I would have no issue with it! I'm not a fan who thinks my favorite characters and ships are without fault. But this whole drama between them is like reading those terrible fics where one half of the couple cheats on the other or does something else entirely unlikely, just so that the author can create drama, to eventually romantically reunite them in some huge dramatic way. :P I expect more from an official novel...

I do appreciate that Yuna clarifies that she wants to be with him, regardless. But for me, that doesn't excuse her acting bizarrely towards him... not speaking to him for hours, and then being annoyed at him when they finally DO spend time together. That's not the Yuna I came to know when playing the games, and I agree: this is not the couple I watched grow together in X, and rooted for in X-2. :/

I feel kinda lame for focusing on the romance of the story more than aything else, because I know there are other interesting things going on, but at the same time, their love is one of the huge reasons that X & X-2 are dear to so many fans. And so far, I agree: I don't think Nojima is respecting or paying homage to that. It's really upsetting, because I enjoy many things about this game, but what comes foremost for me is the CHARACTERS and their relationships. That's what made me absolutely fall in love with the games. And these new additions don't seem to put any emphasis at all on those things... :/



THAT SAID, on a somewhat related note... would you guys mind if, if I gave you full credit for the translation and linked back to here, if I kind of rework this translation a little bit and reposted it somewhere? I think some of the people who follow me on my blog would be interested in reading this, but the way Yuna and Tidus speak in this is very different to how they sound in the games, and I think that would throw people off. So I'd like to rewrite the dialogue a little to make it sound more like them! Not to change or alter the translation at all, just like... reword it, basically. The meaning of their words would be the exact same, just expressed differently, basically.  :p I write a lot of FFX fic & roleplaying, so I think I have a fairly decent grasp of how their characters speak in the English version, so I'd like to make it try to sound that way, if that makes any sense?? It's not a matter of me wanting to change the translation or anything, I just want to kind of make their dialogue sound more like it does in the games.

It just kind of sounds like a sort of fun project to do for me, since I love writing as the FFX characters in roleplay and fics anyway. But I'd be tweaking your translation just a tiny bit, so if that bothers you, it's totally okay if you don't want me to do that!!! If you would rather that I didn't, I have no issue with that! I'll just keep on reading your great work, no matter what ^^
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on May 30, 2015, 04:06:41 pm
Hey, that's a good idea. I write a fair bit of FFX fanfiction myself (I'm even working on an AU right now, and pretty much all I've written is TxY fluff and stories) so it'll be nice seeing how you handle it.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on May 30, 2015, 04:54:08 pm
I don't mind, do as you want.  :)

I was just watching again some scenes in FFX-2 and I found something very interesting. It's about the final meeting between Shuyin and Lenne. I'd like you to remember their position because... well you'll see soon.  :P

Also, when did Lenne enter Yuna's body ? It could affect her traits, what do you think ? It's just an idea, don't take it too seriously.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on June 17, 2015, 02:50:58 pm
Sorry everyone, I'm a bit busy at the moment.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on June 17, 2015, 08:19:36 pm
After much stress involving moving multiple times (and I still am! I'm starting to feel like a nomad) I'm back! :)

Yuna did seem a bit out of character. But, at the same time, she seemed scared - the island looked like Besaid, but everything about it seemed off: Tidus acting like nothing was wrong kind of put her off. It's a natural response when you are afraid of something and somebody else acts like it's not a big deal. It's not like when she was on her pilgrimage, when she knew her destiny and had to face it head-on, but something that was entirely out of her control: she was completely lost, stranded on an island that looked like Besaid, but at the same time didn't; didn't have the slightest bit of hope of finding a way to go back and her partner and former guardian acted like a child and sort of demeaned her by acting like it was no big deal. Anyone would act that way, I think.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on July 10, 2015, 01:34:18 pm
The next chapter will be released tomorrow (saturday).  :)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on July 11, 2015, 04:12:10 am
Actually, it seems like someone already translated the whole of the novel and put a plot summary on FFWiki: http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Final_Fantasy_X-2.5_~Eien_no_Daish%C5%8D~

To be honest, I'm not really interested in this novella any more; I think it's too convoluted. And I've all but given up hope that SE are going to follow up on this with a sequel.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on July 11, 2015, 04:41:51 am
Hello! Fanfic writer Danko Kaji here! It's nice to meet you all. :D

I just wanted to say I truly appreciate all these threads and discussions, but most of all your thorough translation of the novel. I would love to continue reading The Price of Eternity until the very end, regardless of its half-hearted and convoluting narrative, because I want to respect its canonical quality. Speaking of which, I wanted to ask if it's alright for me to conduct a Restoration Project (or complete rewrite) of the novel, giving you full credit as the main inspiring source of the whole translation. I don't know if it's just me or it's the writer in me who sees a challenge, but I see so much untapped potential in this that I want to jump in and explore/flesh it out completely.

Again, I really appreciate what you're doing here. I apologize for saying nothing before.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on July 11, 2015, 05:20:18 am
That would be nice! Actually, I was thinking of making a one-shot fanfiction of Tidus' narrative from Will, segregating into a potential scenario and set-up for X-3. It'll only be borrowing a few elements from X-2.5 though because frankly, I can't keep up and weave around all these weird plot points.

I think now that I'm proofreading the excerpts from the novella, I can see why those other translators chose not to go further: It's just so disheartening and a jarring transition from the feel-good nature of X-2's ending. I feel like Nojima somehow is doing too much for the source material, yet not staying true to it at the same time.

It's sad because FFX and X-2 were a big part of the stage when I was growing up. I loved the characters, their interactions and the unique world in which it was set, and it inspired me to create my own fantasy worlds. But reading this after having the uplifting ending of X-2 imprinted in my mind after all these years just feels strange and wrong. It feels like I've been had. Cheated out, even. And the audio drama didn't help.

And now there's apparently some sort of alternate reality-Spira, the characters are behaving oddly, among other things. 'Oh, but don't worry, they'll explain it all in X-3.' But... it's been a year and a half and no official news has come out about the matter in that time, apart from interviews. Just because there were interviews with a creative team who has little to no say in the company's business means that X-3 is confirmed. Just because the remaster came out on the PS4 doesn't mean X-3 is confirmed.

I just think Square realised their mistakes and just left the bonus material 'up to interpretation,' because sequel baiting a 12-year-old game pretty much just left FFX in an unresolved, head-scratching limbo.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on July 11, 2015, 05:23:23 am
Actually, it seems like someone already translated the whole of the novel and put a plot summary on FFWiki: http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Final_Fantasy_X-2.5_~Eien_no_Daish%C5%8D~

To be honest, I'm not really interested in this novella any more; I think it's too convoluted. And I've all but given up hope that SE are going to follow up on this with a sequel.

Actually, I have been aware of it for a long time, but since it's just a summary, it doesn't make explicit the conversations. That's why I dediced to carry on this translation. If you don't want to fix it anymore, I can ask someone else, like Danko Kaji for example.

Hello! Fanfic writer Danko Kaji here! It's nice to meet you all. :D

I just wanted to say I truly appreciate all these threads and discussions, but most of all your thorough translation of the novel. I would love to continue reading The Price of Eternity until the very end, regardless of its half-hearted and convoluting narrative, because I want to respect its canonical quality. Speaking of which, I wanted to ask if it's alright for me to conduct a Restoration Project (or complete rewrite) of the novel, giving you full credit as the main inspiring source of the whole translation. I don't know if it's just me or it's the writer in me who sees a challenge, but I see so much untapped potential in this that I want to jump in and explore/flesh it out completely.

Again, I really appreciate what you're doing here. I apologize for saying nothing before.

Thank you for your support ! I'll be delighted to let you rewrite the novel. Actually, I didn't except people to read a great translation. It's just sufficient for the understanding. Just be aware that Kush speaks in very polite way, so don't throw away the fact that she uses of the polite "vous". If you have an english equivalent, that's fine.

EDIT : Oh my mistake, you were thinking of writing a fanfic ?

Aside from that, I'm surprised that no one thinks Ifahnal has murdered Tidus. :)

EDIT 2 :
And now there's apparently some sort of alternate reality-Spira, the characters are behaving oddly, among other things. 'Oh, but don't worry, they'll explain it all in X-3.' But... it's been a year and a half and no official news has come out about the matter in that time, apart from interviews. Just because there were interviews with a creative team who has little to no say in the company's business means that X-3 is confirmed. Just because the remaster came out on the PS4 doesn't mean X-3 is confirmed.

You know, Shuyin controled directly people in FFX-2, so the fact that Tidus may control people's mind doesn't seem abnormal.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on July 11, 2015, 05:37:13 am
Actually, I think it'd be more beneficial if Danko did the proofreading from now on. :P It would give them some time to think over how they should re-word the conversations in their rewrite.

I'll just leave the translation thread unlocked from now on, if that's okay with him/her.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on July 11, 2015, 05:52:54 am
But people could post comments in this thread. It would be better to give him/her rights, no ?
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on July 11, 2015, 05:55:13 am
As much as I wish to jump into it straight away (I've done heavy ground work for Chapter 1 already, and a thorough outline for half the novel), I'll be leaving on a month-long trip to Bulgaria to visit my family. I don't doubt there will internet there, but considering it's my first time out of the country and everyone from my cousins to the entire neighborhood wants to meet me, I won't have any free time. But I can promise to finish Chapter 1 and present it to you before I leave in two weeks. Also, I don't plan to post the Restoration novel until I complete the entire thing.

I see. When it comes to the characters mannerisms, I won't hesitate to ask for clarification! :D

Oh, did Ifahnal really murder Tidus? It was either too vague for me to notice or I assumed it was one of those remnant Bedohls leftover from the War. Regardless of who exactly threw the bomb, I thought the inhabitant reacted like anyone would if someone intruded on their home/territory. Especially considering we look through such narrow filters, we immediately jump to the conclusion an outside force harbors some deep, personal plot against Tidus or Yuna. (By the way, which chapter reveals/hints that Ifahnal killed Tidus?)

Fanfic? Yeah. It's not like I can profit out of novelizing a novel. As a fanfic, I can not only revise and flesh out all the original source material, I can add additional (fanon) material loyal to canon continuity. Example: Baralai, Gippal, and Nooj's side of the same time span, such as agreeing to personal interviews with Shelinda after their speech, and the Crimson Trio traveling together and having heart-to-heart talks on their way back home. It'd fall within the same time span as the entire novel (which is less than a week, I believe, before the Perfect Ending six months later), and I want to weave in the Last Mission as well. I don't know. I've just got big plans for a FFX-3 fic, and I want to build up towards Will with an in-depth story.

I've seen a couple attempts at a FFX-3 story preceding -Will- and the novel, which are commendable and amazing, but I want to explore an entirely different angle than just the "epic deconstruction and restoration of Tidus/Yuna love story." I want FFX-3 to be about Spira, the state of the world, the issues and conflicts that are disrupting the natural order of the world. And I want to write that narrative through Baralai, the Chancellor of the Spiran Council, because he's the perfect position. If anything, the three main characters will be Yuna and Tidus, of course, and Baralai as the new entrant (with his mother, ex-Summoner/now Head Coordinator of the Senders, and his father, ex-Guardian, a Monk/Assassin character who's the main man of reconnaissance behind the Yevoner Hunters issue, as main OCs), and Chuami and Kurgum as main supporting. I have so many ideas, I've been plotting them out on paper and blog posts.

Link to my Tumblr post about the mechanics of pyreflies and my headcanon to the whole 'What is Tidus?' controversy. http://dankokaji.tumblr.com/post/122688875547/mekhack-dankokaji-lureofthesea

Oh, yeah. And I'm a woman. Not that I'm offended or anything, just felt like clarifying. XD

I'm alright with the unlocked thread. (Does that mean you temporarily locked it thinking there's no point in keeping open for the public?)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on July 11, 2015, 05:58:27 am
Hm... I'm not really sure how to mod someone on this website.

I suppose we could just encourage people to post their opinions elsewhere. I put a notice on the starting post in the translation thread. Anybody who posts on the thread will just have their comment deleted/moved.

WAIT. Wait-wait-wait, Denko. I recognise you from FF.Net. You're the person who writes all that BaralaixYuna stuff, aren't you? :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on July 11, 2015, 06:01:13 am
As for the 'Tidus is warping people's behavior' concern, I believe in that possibility to a certain extent. Although I do believe Tidus's existence is quite turbulent, if not sensitive (less so than before he officially died), I don't think it's right to use it as an excuse why everyone's "acting strange" for our liking, let alone play it up for dramatic effect. Tidus may be incomplete, but he's a benevolent sentient being.

Oh, man, now I really want to type up my version of Chapter 1 to show how exactly I interpreted it. I guess you can say it's my way of justifying their behavior? Or my way of filling in the blanks using my imagination. Should I send Chapter 1 through private email or post it in its own thread?
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on July 11, 2015, 06:14:40 am
Well, since Danko seems to be busy, I hope you can carry on with the translation COL !


Why do I assume Ifahnal murdered Tidus ? Well... if you remember something related to gunpowder, you may have you answer. I'm sorry, I don't want to say more for the moment because I plan to post an article about this on a website (a french one), and I don't want to spread the information yet.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on July 11, 2015, 06:19:59 am
That would be nice! Actually, I was thinking of making a one-shot fanfiction of Tidus' narrative from Will, segregating into a potential scenario and set-up for X-3. It'll only be borrowing a few elements from X-2.5 though because frankly, I can't keep up and weave around all these weird plot points.

Ooh, me, too! I want to write an entire, cohesive plot that encompasses all the separate canon stories (novel, Last Mission, -Will-), and perhaps call it 'The Eternal Cost Reborn In One Year' or something to that effect. We can feed off each other's headcanon and inspire our writing. :3

I think now that I'm proofreading the excerpts from the novella, I can see why those other translators chose not to go further: It's just so disheartening and a jarring transition from the feel-good nature of X-2's ending. I feel like Nojima somehow is doing too much for the source material, yet not staying true to it at the same time.

It's sad because FFX and X-2 were a big part of the stage when I was growing up. I loved the characters, their interactions and the unique world in which it was set, and it inspired me to create my own fantasy worlds. But reading this after having the uplifting ending of X-2 imprinted in my mind after all these years just feels strange and wrong. It feels like I've been had. Cheated out, even. And the audio drama didn't help.

Hmm, I suppose the reason why I'm not disheartened/disgusted/shocked by the novel's content because I never invested myself in the Good/Perfect Endings? And don't hate me when I say this, but I never placed the Tidus/Yuna pairing on a high pedestal either. I love Tidus, I really really do, I adore that little baby. He's the reason why I learned to naturally question the world around me growing up, questioning what's normal and what's not. And I passively like the Tidus/Yuna relationship; I respect it more than anything else. The Yuna I love in FFX-2 wouldn't have existed without Tidus. Unfortunately, my feelings for the pairing soured because of the fandom, but I still do like it.

However, what made the sequel such a brilliant story to me was Yuna's personal journey. I enjoyed watching her take initiative, wear her hair loose with her girlfriends, explore the world and reconnect with people. I love that. And when I earned the Normal Ending my first playthrough (with no knowledge of alternate endings whatsoever), I turned off the game with a happy note. But then the fairy-tale, feel-good, half-baked 'Tidus is back bc the Fayth finally decided to reward Yuna for saving the world a second time' endings pissed me off like nothing in the world. Okay, if you're going to bring Tidus back, at least do a good job of it. Even Nojima robbed me of that satisfaction. With the inclusion of the novel and audio drama, I'm intrigued, but I am left with wanting more.

So, yeah. Stuff like that motivates me to write fanfiction. To fill in the missing pieces with the help of what canon they were gracious enough to leave for us obsessive dedicated fans.

And now there's apparently some sort of alternate reality-Spira, the characters are behaving oddly, among other things. 'Oh, but don't worry, they'll explain it all in X-3.' But... it's been a year and a half and no official news has come out about the matter in that time, apart from interviews. Just because there were interviews with a creative team who has little to no say in the company's business means that X-3 is confirmed. Just because the remaster came out on the PS4 doesn't mean X-3 is confirmed.

I just think Square realised their mistakes and just left the bonus material 'up to interpretation,' because sequel baiting a 12-year-old game pretty much just left FFX in an unresolved, head-scratching limbo.

I don't know what to say about that. I've stopped caring what the businessmen/artists say. I've stopped waiting for more news.

I'm just eager to write my own story about it.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on July 11, 2015, 06:21:30 am
Well, since Danko seems to be busy, I hope you can carry on with the translation COL !

Why do I assume Ifahnal murdered Tidus ? Well... if you remember something related to gunpowder, you may have you answer. I'm sorry, I don't want to say more for the moment because I plan to post an article about this on a website (a french one), and I don't want to spread the information yet.

Oh, okay. No problem! I was under the impression it was already clarified in the current translations. I can wait. :3
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on July 11, 2015, 06:23:20 am
WAIT. Wait-wait-wait, Danko. I recognise you from FF.Net. You're the person who writes all that BaralaixYuna stuff, aren't you? :P

CAUGHT GUILTY. Yes, I am. XD Oh, gosh, I'm so embarrassed, but flattered that you recognized me... *blush*
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on July 11, 2015, 06:27:11 am
WAIT. Wait-wait-wait, Danko. I recognise you from FF.Net. You're the person who writes all that BaralaixYuna stuff, aren't you? :P

CAUGHT GUILTY. Yes, I am. Oh, gosh, I'm so embarrassed, but flattered that you recognized me... *blush*

Haha, I'm actually PersonaOfBetrayal on that website. Taking a little break from writing, though. I was working non-stop on my FFX AU and I've worn myself out.

I've had multiple ideas for an FFX-3 scenario flash through my mind. I can never seem to focus on just one, and depending on my mood or what I'm thinking about I may just start thinking up an entirely new setting. I could just tell you all the ideas I've had ever since this novella bombshell dropped. :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on July 11, 2015, 06:36:05 am
Haha, I'm actually PersonaOfBetrayal on that website. Taking a little break from writing, though. I was working non-stop on my FFX AU and I've worn myself out.

I've had multiple ideas for an FFX-3 scenario flash through my mind. I can never seem to focus on just one, and depending on my mood or what I'm thinking about I may just start thinking up an entirely new setting. I could just tell you all the ideas I've had ever since this novella bombshell dropped. :P

Coolio! I'll be sure to check out your stuff and read them. :3

Usually I never venture into Tidus/Yuna fanfiction, but in consideration of Tidus's return to canon, I've been picking up stories to read up on their relationship. I'm liking Spira's Dream more than I expected, but I don't particularly agree with the author's headcanon about how Tidus and Shuyin are connected. I honestly believe Tidus is a descendent of the Dream!Shuyin. That's all I want to say about it at the moment.

And that'd be awesome! I love sharing plot bunnies/personal headcanons. <3
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on July 11, 2015, 08:14:26 am
I send the chapter to COL. Tidus is very mysterious in this chapter because he's very confident. Maybe he has absorbed some memories of the island when he came back to life (I mean pyreflies) and so that may be why he seems "familiar" with the place where they're located in this chapter. You'll know what I mean when you'll read the chapter.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on July 11, 2015, 08:45:24 am
Sweet! As annoyingly vague as the novel is, it does give me a lot of breathing room for my imagination. That's a very good idea, that Tidus may have absorbed memories, or residual pyreflies, from the island in his return. Is it just me, or does he seem super chill about strange, supernatural things (like clairvoyant knowledge, Jecht's random cameo, and his eerily accurate assumption of the island)?

I'm going to sleep now, but after I wake up I'll definitely respond to your pm!  :D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on July 11, 2015, 07:22:45 pm
I can proofread it before posting (taking over for CystalofLies) if you'd like! :)

I've been kind of re-writing the dialogue to sound, imo, more like tidus/yuna, and fixing some stuff on my tumblr  (HI DANKO THIS IS SHUYIIN, l o l), so I don't mind!

I can either do that, to make it sound more like "official FFX", or just keep it pretty raw, that way people can sort of... come to whatever conclusion they want. I don't care :P


edited to add link in case you're curious~: http://shuyiin.tumblr.com/post/120421585381/final-fantasy-x-2-5-eternal-cost . (aw, crap, I forgot I changed my url so none of the links work, surely you jest. you just have to change the moungagazet part to shuyiin. I'll fix it later xD)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on July 11, 2015, 09:42:13 pm
SHUYIIN, IS THAT U

FRIEND *HOLDS HANDS*

It's official. You are my Beta reader, kk. Sings::"We're all in this together~"

(I'll definitely need to write an extensive Disclaimer/Dedication page for everyone involved. <3)

Also, the more I work on the novel/read fanfiction for reference/research canon, the more Baralai/Yuna/Tidus is becoming my OT3 (I've never had  an OT3 before, cuz love triangles make me uncomfortable, but wtf those three are perfect. Imagine the angst and bromance between B/T! Baralidus sounds like a nice shipping name for them, don't you think? XD)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on July 11, 2015, 11:12:59 pm
I THINK BARALAI AND TIDUS WOULD HAVE A REALLY INTERESTING RELATIONSHIP.

I feel like Baralai would initially be super suspicious of him, because of his similarities to Shuyin, and also he's about 90% sure this guy was dead just a few days ago, wHAT THE ****, adihaudaw.
And Tidus might be a little skeevy because he's a Yevonite and very Yevon people tend to annoy him.
BUT once they get over their first impressions of one another, I think there could be a really fun relationship there! :D

But yeah, ajdhauwid, I do like the little details in this novel. It's confirmed a few headcanons of mine, like a lot of the info we get about the bond between the summoner and the fayth, and some little random things about Yuna's upbringing in Besaid.

The overall plot thread in it, though... sigh. It's just a contrived mess.

Sidenote: the Spira's Dream trilogy is my favorite X/X-2 fanfiction ever!! I'm very picky about fics, but that one gets my stamp of approval. I hope you continue to like it :D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on July 11, 2015, 11:32:16 pm
YES, not only super suspicious, but like instant heart attack because his evil likeness hella traumatized him. Imagine Baralai needed a whole year to recover from that mess, physically, emotionally, mentally, and psychologically. So of course when once they meet for the first time Baralai would be very wary, but polite as always, and Tidus would just be giving him the look, because he'll be wondering 'Is this the guy Yuna was talking about?' (even though I highly doubt there existed any truth to Yuna's 'I like someone else' BS), but yeah. Plus, Tidus won't take kindly to the fact Baralai was Seymour's vassal once upon a time, asjhdgajf. What will ultimately break the ice between them is when Tidus watches him at work, delegating outside the office, building bridges, and making public appearances to quell outbreaks and unrest, and he'll realize Baralai really does care about Spira.

But anyway... Reading through Chapter 18, LOVIN' the canon bits! Now I know what Spira's stance on "Gods" and "Fayth" are. Interesting. I really wanna look up real life references of those statues, see if they are inspired by actual mythology. (I still have to read the rest of the chapter, though.)

Everything's a contrived mess past FFX-2. XD I'm just here for the roller coaster ride.

I do plan to read the entire Spira's Dream trilogy (plus prequel), among other Tidus/Yuna fics. There's plenty to glean from despite my criticism for certain things. It's just nice to read about other people's fanon novels; it helps me develop my own headcanon. <3
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on July 12, 2015, 08:53:53 am
I can proofread it before posting (taking over for CystalofLies) if you'd like! :)

I've been kind of re-writing the dialogue to sound, imo, more like tidus/yuna, and fixing some stuff on my tumblr  (HI DANKO THIS IS SHUYIIN, l o l), so I don't mind!

I can either do that, to make it sound more like "official FFX", or just keep it pretty raw, that way people can sort of... come to whatever conclusion they want. I don't care :P


edited to add link in case you're curious~: http://shuyiin.tumblr.com/post/120421585381/final-fantasy-x-2-5-eternal-cost . (aw, crap, I forgot I changed my url so none of the links work, surely you jest. you just have to change the moungagazet part to shuyiin. I'll fix it later xD)

Well, I'll give you the translations frow now on, but just keep it raw because any changes could distort the entire novel. But I don't mind if someone wishes to rewrite the entire translation to make it more "english". I'm not a very good translator. This translation is just sufficient for the understanding. The main words are keep unchanged so that you don't miss anything about the content, but the sentences may not sound like what you could read in an english novel, I'm very aware of that. That's why I encourage everyone to rewrite the entire novel to make it better for the readers. But I don't want to mislead them, the content must not be changed, else it won't be the same novel.


Oh, and I read on your tumblr that I took an unoffcial japanese to french translation. That's not right ! The translation is official ! Lumen Editions have published an official french translation of the novel. :)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on July 12, 2015, 11:24:46 am
Alrighty, sounds good! Just sent it over to me, and I'll send it back with a tiny bit of proofreading!:)

And oh okay, I'll go fix that, sorry!! I thought Lumens was just... a fan company or something. :p
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on July 12, 2015, 08:23:01 pm
After some consideration, I think I will keep to the original idea of just restoring FFX-2.5 without fanfiction mixed in. The narrative's already convoluting as it is (I mean, Nojima did write the story behind FFXIII), and it'd be much simpler to treat it as a Restoration Project than a glorified fanfiction of revised canon. Thank you, ChercheurObscur, for indirectly convincing me to make up my mind...? XD
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: LightningxHope on July 13, 2015, 06:02:04 am
Just registered to say big thank you for the translations. I find it depressing that Yuna and Tidus can't live together without worries.
Soo in what kind of state is Tidus now? Is he an unsent? Because if he realizes he got beckoned, then he will disappear, right? Between couples there is always drama. Someday she would get mad at him and tell him about that.. and bum he will be gone. Danng, screw you nojima. All we fans just longed for a happy end.

The fact that Yuna analyzes  Tidus all the time and gets annoyed doesn't bother me. That's what women do after all.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on July 13, 2015, 06:33:49 pm
Just registered to say big thank you for the translations. I find it depressing that Yuna and Tidus can't live together without worries.
Soo in what kind of state is Tidus now? Is he an unsent? Because if he realizes he got beckoned, then he will disappear, right? Between couples there is always drama. Someday she would get mad at him and tell him about that.. and bum he will be gone. Danng, screw you nojima. All we fans just longed for a happy end.

The fact that Yuna analyzes  Tidus all the time and gets annoyed doesn't bother me. That's what women do after all.

Thank you ! :D

Well, Tidus is an incarnate spirit. He's like an unsent, but he still exists in Spira because of someone else will. On the contrary, unsents still exist in Spira because of their own will. There's also a huge difference in what we could call "physical integrity". An Unsent will only go into the Farplane if he's willing to do so (or if a summoner performs a sending against its will). An incarnate spirit is very fragile, if the person learns about his condition, he will disappear.


On another note, you will meet again a cute little girl in the next chapter !  ;)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on July 14, 2015, 04:23:00 am
Well, Tidus is an incarnate spirit. He's like an unsent, but he still exists in Spira because of someone else will. On the contrary, unsents still exist in Spira because of their own will. There's also a huge difference in what we could call "physical integrity". An Unsent will only go into the Farplane if he's willing to do so (or if a summoner performs a sending against its will). An incarnate spirit is very fragile, if the person learns about his condition, he will disappear.

I like that! Incarnate spirit... It has a nice ring to it, instead of just calling them "beckoned" spirits. And physical integrity, too! I was struggling for the longest time how to differentiate the unique processes Unsents go through, especially with the emergence of a new "state of being." You have amazing terminology! :D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on July 15, 2015, 03:31:51 pm
Haha, thanks  ;)

Just here to tell you that the next chapter will be released tomorrow (thursday).  :)
But if kk is absent, you'll have to wait, unless someone volunteers to fix it in his place.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on July 15, 2015, 03:47:26 pm
I might be able to do it over night... Just let me get home and I'll say if I can or not. :)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on July 15, 2015, 04:57:45 pm
I should be available to edit it! ^^
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on July 16, 2015, 10:18:10 am
Hello !

Actually, I'm done with the translation of the chapter, but I have a doubt about something. From now on, Yuna will converse with Kush but she'll use the polite 'vous'. What do I do ? Since Kush uses this polite 'vous', isn't natural to use it too for Yuna ? Furthermore, I'll have to use it when she'll talk with Ifahnal because he doesn't use this polite 'vous', but Yuna is. It's like a form of respect towards an old person.


On another note, enjoy this recent wonderful FFX piano medley :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hP3DPsg2PT4 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hP3DPsg2PT4)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on July 16, 2015, 03:32:05 pm
Hmmm, well, we don't really have a word like that in English, but there are other ways of denoting respect towards a superior/elder! Using sir/ma'am, speaking in a formal tone... as far as I can think of at the moment, that's all I can think of. D:
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on July 16, 2015, 03:53:40 pm
Okay, well I will use 'sir' for Ifahnal, furthermore he asks her to call him like that, so that's great.

But Kush is 'younger' than Yuna so I don't know how you'll denote respect towards her. Do your best x)

Actually, the polite 'vous' was used earlier in the novel, when Valm adressed Alb for example, but I decided to use a simple 'you' because I thought it was not necessary. But since we've decided to use this polite 'vous' for Kush's conversations, we need to keep a semblance of coherence if someone uses the polite 'vous' to talk to her, right ? (just for your information, Valm used a simple 'you' when he talked to Kush)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on July 17, 2015, 12:53:07 pm
Fioouu, the chapter is out !  thanks kk !   :D

I updated my first posts on this topic and the one related to the translation, so that people know you're working with me now !  ;)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on July 17, 2015, 12:59:13 pm
OH, apparently they did work! :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on July 17, 2015, 01:01:05 pm
The messaging system on here is weird. xD

Really interesting chapter. I don't understand what's going on at the end, though. Was Tidus turning to pyreflies? Because Yuna had some distant memories of the summoner? Is that why she made him do that, to ground himself or something?

Or... it says she was trying to send her consciousness to the pyreflies to connect with the summoner. Which makes sense, but then why did Tidus have to do all that stuff? O_o
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on July 17, 2015, 01:11:36 pm
Actually, Tidus is an incarnate spirit, so he can easily turn into pyreflies I think, like an unsent. The pyreflies coming from Kush have certainly caused that. And the novel makes it explicite : "the silhouette of Tidus was blending into the pyreflies."

I don't understand your last question  ???

Anyway, the interesting fact here is when Yuna tells Tidus to stand on his knees, and then when she embraces him. Does this scenery ring a bell to anyone ?  :) Remember the ending of Final Fantasy X-2...  ;)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on July 17, 2015, 01:20:32 pm
Oh, okay! Yeah, second question doesn't matter if the first part was true! I just wasn't sure if the novel was saying he was 'fading'/turning to pyreflies, or... what. Interesting...
How does he seriously not notice that happening to him?? Sheesh, Tidus. :P

But, yeah, nice little throwback to Shuyin and Lenne! xD
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on July 17, 2015, 01:21:12 pm
I thought about two hypotheses: that Tidus's existence has grown fainter due to him being an incarnate spirit, or that he has actually become 'part' of that summoning that was starting to fade.

On a second note, who was the core for Ifarnal to summon the island, and why did he do it? O.o Is it mentioned in the novel?
Besides, why did he murder Tidus? Does it have to be with testing Yuna's ability to beckon him? That the multiple beckonings could weaken the Farplane? I'm so confused. :(
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on July 17, 2015, 01:27:19 pm
On a second note, who was the core for Ifarnal to summon the island, and why did he do it? O.o Is it mentioned in the novel?

Yes, it is. you just have to wait.  :)

Besides, why did he murder Tidus? Does it have to be with testing Yuna's ability to beckon him? That the multiple beckonings could weaken the Farplane? I'm so confused. :(

Be careful, I don't know if Ifahnal has really murdered Tidus. I just have some clues. But I can't tell you yet.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on July 17, 2015, 01:31:02 pm
Be careful, I don't know if Ifahnal has really murdered Tidus. I just have some clues. But I can't tell you yet.

:S

I kind of agreed with you, because of the gunpowder thing in the ship and then the bomb falling on his head out of the f*king blue, but if it has something to do with Shuyin, I don't believe they had ever met during the war... Unless...
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on July 17, 2015, 03:27:22 pm
Shuyin has nothing to do with my clues.


The next chapter is about Bria's past.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on July 17, 2015, 03:35:12 pm
Awww. I'm so curious!  :-X Hahahaha.

Yay Bria! Poor guy. :( At least he was spared a worse fate...
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on July 18, 2015, 06:28:55 pm
Hey ! I was in a good mood today, so I translated the whole chapter !  :D

From now on, the chapters are short, so the releases will be more frequent/common/usual (choose the right word, I don't know which one is correct)  ;D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on July 18, 2015, 09:30:28 pm
Yay! :D That's the spirit!
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on July 19, 2015, 10:52:09 am
Done with chapters 20, 21 and 22 !

Things are starting to accelerate ! The end is near...  :)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on July 20, 2015, 04:09:29 pm
At this rate, you'll finish translating the entire novel by the time I return from Bulgaria next month. XD

I'll be leaving Wednesday morning, so I won't be able to write long messages for awhile. Just wanted to give a head's up. :3
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on July 21, 2015, 06:43:56 pm
Yeah !  :D

I think some of you wonder why the chapters are not online yet. Well, let's say someone did a little mistake huhuhu  :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on July 21, 2015, 09:02:11 pm
*shifty eyes* totally wasn't me!



(It was. >.> haha! Chapters should be up soon, though!)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on July 21, 2015, 09:07:26 pm
I thought so! You're so adorable, Shuyiin. XD

Oh, yeah. I wanted to ask: What would you like me to refer to you as? By kk or Shuyiin?

P.S. You haven't responded to my last message on Tumblr, yet. :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on July 21, 2015, 09:22:30 pm
Haha !  :D

Well, I'm tired so I will post all the chapters tomorrow. It's currently 4:20 am in France, so expect the chapters around 2:00 pm.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on July 24, 2015, 05:41:50 pm
Well, a lot of chapters have been released recently !  ;D

I love the fact that some towns had a different name in the past. It's like Lutece and Paris. Nojima did a good job there.  :D

About the next chapter, I'm sure you'll like it, it deals with the Al Bhed. But I think CrystalOfLies won't be happy at the end of the chapter.  :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on July 25, 2015, 09:02:06 pm
So Bria did have a child as an unsent! :O

Btw...

Yay! I got the thing about Yunalesca right! She was indeed the Summoner Princess! :D Which makes Yu Yevon the Mage of Zanarkand. Yay! This sorta confirms my headcanon on the Machina War :D

EDIT: I think some of the Al Bhed language in the translation is off. "Good evening" is actually "Kuut ajahehk". Fyi ;)

Omg I sooooooooo want to read more! I wonder why Ifarnal is avoiding Yuna, is it because he's afraid she might send him? Or does it have something to do with the Tidus murder thing? :o My mind is blown.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on July 26, 2015, 08:02:25 am
EDIT: I think some of the Al Bhed language in the translation is off. "Good evening" is actually "Kuut ajahehk". Fyi ;)

Oh ! It seems that I used the translator the wrong way... for one word ? Strange... I'll fix that ! Thanks !  ;)

Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on August 01, 2015, 08:55:10 am
Wait... so Ifahnal summoned the island using Kush as the aeon core? I mean, what for?
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on August 01, 2015, 04:57:56 pm
Sorry for the long wait! My fault! My four month old prefers to watch me do something more interesting than proof-reading, apparently. xD

Chapter 25 has some really interesting info on Spira's past, in my opinion, so look forward to that! And 26 has some interesting info on aeon cores/summoning, too...
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on August 01, 2015, 09:31:15 pm
It's okay, kids >>>>>>>>>>>>>> translations. :p

Yaaaaaaaay! More lore makes me happy happy!
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on August 14, 2015, 09:22:21 am
I don't know why you thought I would be upset by this chapter, Obscur. It's just Bria not being very bright. :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on August 14, 2015, 09:30:01 am
Haha, I'm back !  :D

The new chapters are online.  ;D

Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on August 14, 2015, 03:07:30 pm
Ugh.. cliffhangers! D:

Ifarnal seems to have acknowledged that he was a stupid brat back in his day, but he still retains some of that arrogance. "Sire Johit"... surely you jest.

Wtf is wrong with Bria? D: He's batshit insane.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on August 17, 2015, 04:44:27 pm
Haha, Bria needs to avenge himself ! Of course he's insane !  ;D

4 chapters left (translation)... But this is not the end, I have a lot of things to tell you after that !  :D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Pyreflies_of_MJ on August 17, 2015, 05:55:53 pm
I haven't been on in a looooong time, nor have I immersed myself in this stuff. I just can't. While I appreciate the effort put into translating the book, all of it just makes me too genuinely mad to read anymore. It's funny because after a while I was able to laugh about it, but coming back to it just fuels the burning embers of rage, surely you jest. What perhaps upsets me the most, beyond the disease infested **** house that has become the Tidus and Yuna love story, is the fact that they have stopped really giving a **** about Tidus. Tidus is my favorite and his character got no respect here at all. It's bullsh*t. Yuna is a boring martyr without Tidus. And we've seen/heard that kind of thing a thousand and one times.

The story Square threw together is as contrived as it is nonsensical and offensive. It culminates into something that is equally boring as it is maddening. Square Enix has been ****ing up lately and it's because they are putting all the focus on constructing a needlessly convoluted plot, with no respect given to the characters. And the characters are what makes Final Fantasy, Final Fantasy.

I. Can. Not.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on August 18, 2015, 02:33:36 am
Oh my god, Pyreflies! You're back!

Better be careful with what you say. They've convinced themselves that the novella is good and interesting. :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on August 18, 2015, 06:24:40 am
Haha, it's not like I forbid people to hate the novel !  ;D

But I think you miss the most important thing in this novel : the distress of Tidus about his current state and how it's difficult to bring back someone after two years of  absence. That's the guiding principle of this novel. And Nojima illustrates this point magnificently... But if you don't like that, I won't curse you, don't worry.  :P

The story dealing with Kush, Valm and Ifahnal was used by Nojima to create a parallel with the current story and to give you hints on some mysterious events in this noveL... like Tidus' death for example, Ifahnal killed him but nobody seems to notice that fact (maybe you need the two last hints you've not seen yet, but I didn't need them to deduce that).

I understand perfectly if you don't like the writing style of Nojima, but... well... I like it.  :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on August 18, 2015, 02:00:45 pm
Well, I still don't like it, but there are small little things I gleam out of the text that I find worthwhile. There are some cool factoids about the Al Bhed and Spira's history and summoning, for example. But I'm reluctant to take any of that new stuff, as cool as it may be, as canon because of how much previously established canon that Nojima has carelessly ignored in the book/audio drama, so it kind of feels wrong to take ANY of this as canon, because that contradicts! xD But I'm trying to not see things as black and white: I'm trying to take the pieces I like, and just ignore the rest, even though that makes no sense...

because Nojima wrote something that is, in my opinion, illlogical and nonsensical, so why should I have to be logical about his nonsense writing? xD

One thing I absolutely can't find any goodness in though is, as MJ mentioned, the characterization of almost all the major characters from X/X-2, which is just dismal. Even besides Yuna and Tidus, there are things about Lulu and Rikku that really bug me, too.

But yeah, I certainly haven't "convinced" myself into thinking this thing is good, that's for certain. I'm just willing to concede that there are SOME interesting parts of it. :P Plus, I'm addicted to reading the thing, like a bad habit. To see what craziness Nojima came up with this time, surely you jest.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on August 19, 2015, 06:47:11 am
Is there a spoiler tag in here? Because I'm beginning to think that I know what Chercheur is talking about, but I'm unsure of whether I should say it here or not. D:

But I'm still unsure of the reason why he'd do it. Does it have something to do with Zanarkand? That Tidus was summoned by Yevon, the "heretic" mentioned in the novella? That he'd be able to weaken the Farplane, which was already unstable, by killing off someone who had already been brought back from it, only to bring him back again and see it blow up from the inside? Jealousy for Kush, perhaps? I don't know. :(

I think I'm the only one here who actually liked the novella. It's not like I expected kittens and rainbows come out of it, you know.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Akuwah on August 19, 2015, 09:08:24 am
Since the translation is already up til Ch. 28, it's going to end soon right? Good. Thanks for the translation ChercheurObscur!  ;)

I was pretty emotional when I first found out about this novel (brb deleting my older posts >_>) but now that I've actually read most of the chapters, I feel somewhat indifferent but at the same time wishing this novel never even existed l o l. There are some good/lulzy moments in the novel (e.g. "Your birthmark" 8)) but that's it. Don't wanna overthink on this anymore but ngl, if SE were to make an X-3, I'd see/play it (and while at it, praying it won't be depressing af)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on August 20, 2015, 09:23:42 am
Whee! I'm back in America! It's good to be home. :D

I think I'm the only one here who actually liked the novella. It's not like I expected kittens and rainbows come out of it, you know.

I actually like the novella, too. Sure, it's fanfiction quality, and I've read better fanfiction, but for what it's worth as canon, it's pretty neat. And I think a lot of things can be justified (not everything) by a little bit of imagination. I think my biggest pet peeve with the novel is the freakin rules that Kush and Ifharnal go by. I mean, sending Tidus back to the real Besaid in search of Bria? Asking Yuna to go here and there? Or is it the other way around? I'm so confused. Why did they have to be so roundabout? Otherwise, I like it. Plus, I enjoy seeing the realistic side of Tidus/Yuna romance. It helps define the timeline of how long they continued dating post-FFX-2. I think by 8 months, when the Spiran Council formed indefinitely after casting aside Yevon (which is wise), Yuna picked up from the ashes to hide the truth. Four months is enough time for 'that' incident with the Yevoners to pass, whatever that was (Yevoners becoming overzealous with Beckoning?), for Yevoner hunters to arise, and for Senders and their assistants to make themselves official. There must be a new system in this government, and I'm curious to see that the writer chose to make Baralai the essential Maester leader of the world, being second to the High Summoner in importance.

So, yeah. In a nutshell, the audio drama, novel, and Last Mission really help establish that one year period that leads up to FFX-3.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on August 20, 2015, 11:07:04 am
It will be fun to talk about the novella after I'm done with the translation, really...  ;)

Two chapters left...
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on August 20, 2015, 11:32:30 am
Hip hip hurray! We're almost done!

Now it's time for me to get started on that Restoration!  8)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: FirexGem on August 21, 2015, 12:31:47 am
Hi I'm new here and I know that you guys are almost finished translating and proof reading all the chapters but I just wanted to say thank you for all your hard work. I know that you all didn't get paid to do this and took the time out of your schedules as well, so I really appreciate it ChercheurObscur, CrystalOfLies, Kk and everyone else. :)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on August 21, 2015, 07:17:07 am
Thank you ! That's very kind of you !  :D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on August 21, 2015, 12:14:14 pm
You know, I think I've figured out what makes the novella/audio drama so off-putting to me, apart from the obvious material.

You see, no matter how serious the situation was, everything in FFX(-2) was romanticised: You had these beautifully-coloured, varying environments and characters; music was constantly playing in the background and you had these cinematic, sometimes exaggerated camera angles. It takes the word 'fantasy' quite seriously. Because of all these factors, even devastating scenes like Kilika and Home's destruction or the failure of Operation Mi'ihen seemed almost poetic or mournful, rather than instilling terror into the player. There was also the pacing of the dialogue, and even in the Japanese version most of the dialogue was written in a poetic format.

But with the audio drama and the novel in particular, everything seems a lot more raw. They seem to get straight to the point with everything with no priority over subtlety when it comes to topics like death. Because we have no visual or audible stimuli, nothing's there to really 'distract' us. We have everything straight-up told to us through dialogue and narration, so graphic descriptions like Chuami's mother's death and Tidus' decapitation become a lot more shocking. If, say, we were told about Home's destruction in written format only, the revelation would be a lot more surprising.

Whether or not this is a good thing is entirely up to opinion, and in my opinion it doesn't really click with me. The FFX saga is an inspiration to me because of its world and its 'show, don't tell' mentality for most things. I think that this is simply just a case of using simpler mediums, since obviously SE didn't want to make a half-hour long cutscene exclusively for a remaster. :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on August 21, 2015, 03:41:56 pm
I'M OFFICIALLY DONE WITH THE TRANSLATION OF THE NOVEL !!!!  :D

What a strange feeling...  :P

Spread the word anywhere you can !  :D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on August 21, 2015, 03:52:27 pm
WOOHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! :D

Right on the eve of my birthday! :D :D :D *sets off fireworks*
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on August 21, 2015, 04:39:28 pm
Really ? Hoho !  :D

Now I'm waiting for kk to fix the last translations, I don't really know where she has gone.  :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: FirexGem on August 22, 2015, 02:00:35 am
You're welcome ChercheurObscur. I can't wait to read the next chapters. I must say it's been a journey reading this novel even if it wasn't what I expected it would be.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on August 22, 2015, 11:07:25 pm
All done fixing the, not that there's much to fix! Look forward to the conclusion soon!

Though, I can't say I like it too much >.>
Makes me really look at that scene in a different light...
But I'll refrain from saying more until it's posted! :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on August 23, 2015, 01:29:12 pm
Hey ! The last chapters are online !  :D

What a journey, if I may say.  ;D

I'd like to thank CrystalOfLies, kk and everyone here ! I've had fun talking with all of you.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on August 23, 2015, 01:30:51 pm
"He had faith in Yuna's smile."

...And then she ditched him to go face Sin with some strangers. THE END.  :P

But thanks for all your work, everyone!
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on August 23, 2015, 01:38:04 pm
"He had faith in Yuna's smile."

...And then she ditched him to go face Sin with some strangers. THE END.  :P

Now you can introduce Marphie without problem in your future fanfic ! :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on August 23, 2015, 02:41:50 pm
That ending is literally the stupidest thing because it defies the canon of the actual scene...

Nojima left out an entire line that Yuna actually spoke, and all of her actions, which defy the mood he is trying to paint this scene as having. The way he describes the scene is so completely opposite of how it actually happened.

Yuna's smile was only 'pale' when he said he might disappear. But  it went away quickly. she was overjoyed after his cheesy line about the Fayth, hahah. She hugs him. She's so giddy she pushs him off a damn cliff, laughing all the while.

That chapter was such a reach and an attempt to inject inflated angst into a scene that canonly has none of that. SMH. u_u There's no way that Yuna would have acted the way she did in the Perfect Ending if she knew he was some summoned ghost thing. She was genuinely content and happy in that moment.

Maybe this book takes place in some kind of 'alternate reality'. Like you know how there's two Besaid's in the book? Maybe there's actually more. three, at least.
The canon one, where things actually took place in the game... Johit's summoned one... and then wherever this book took place.
that's the only way I can make sense of this, haha.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on August 23, 2015, 02:43:26 pm
Anyway-- rants aside... xD

Thanks so much, Chercheur!!!! you put a lot of work into this, and I'm so grateful for that!!!!!!!

even though I may not like the book very much, I'm still so glad for the opportunity to read it, and I never would have gotten that without you!! You're awesome!! :D

And CrystalofLies, too!!!!!!!

One million gold stars to you both. :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on August 23, 2015, 02:47:42 pm
Also, when did Yuna become such a tsundere? She's reunited with Tidus and all she says is, "be more careful and stop apologizing all the time." really?? how does that sound like Yuna at all?? Especially when in the games, SHE'S the one who apologizes way too much............ what the heck is this? surely you jest.

OkAY, SORRY. I'm done now. >.>

Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on August 23, 2015, 02:53:56 pm
Well, read that : http://ffx3chat.createaforum.com/general-discussion/ffx-2-5-tidus-is-just-'corrupting'-everyone/
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on August 23, 2015, 02:56:43 pm

Maybe this book takes place in some kind of 'alternate reality'. Like you know how there's two Besaid's in the book? Maybe there's actually more. three, at least.
The canon one, where things actually took place in the game... Johit's summoned one... and then wherever this book took place.
that's the only way I can make sense of this, haha.


I'm down with that idea. Let's just think that the gritty, realistic X-2.5 and Will is a branching alternate dimension to X-2, while all of the giddy and happy-go-lucky stuff is in another branching alternate dimension to X-2! That way all of the fans can be happy. Because if Nojima can insert alternate dimensions into the 'canon' then so can we! :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on August 24, 2015, 02:10:59 pm
Whelp. That ending.  ???

I think what frustrated me the most was the utter lack of setting detail? Like Tidus jumping from one place to the next, the whole 'the elder ladies wanted to hide the accidental incident' for no apparent good reason? What's the point of ambiguously painting Bria as a villain? So he had the chance to relive his life anew, fall in love again, have a family, which defies the logic of him as an incarnate (dead) spirit? So does imagination serve as the fuel to pyrefly magic? Confusion everywhere.

I feel like when Bria called his relationship with Kush 'a puppy love, a thing of the past,' it seriously foreshadowed Tidus and Yuna's love.

I just think Nojima really hates the Tuna romance, because it does not fit with his original vision.

That's what I'm getting from this mess of a novel.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on August 24, 2015, 02:30:24 pm
Whelp. That ending.  ???

I think what frustrated me the most was the utter lack of setting detail? Like Tidus jumping from one place to the next, the whole 'the elder ladies wanted to hide the accidental incident' for no apparent good reason? What's the point of ambiguously painting Bria as a villain? So he had the chance to relive his life anew, fall in love again, have a family, which defies the logic of him as an incarnate (dead) spirit? So does imagination serve as the fuel to pyrefly magic? Confusion everywhere.

I feel like when Bria called his relationship with Kush 'a puppy love, a thing of the past,' it seriously foreshadowed Tidus and Yuna's love.

I just think Nojima really hates the Tuna romance, because it does not fit with his original vision.

That's what I'm getting from this mess of a novel.

Not to mention, as kk said, how Yuna didn't seem to give a **** about reuniting with Tidus when it was possible that he might not have ever seen her again, and only a few days after their reunion. It seemed she was more annoyed that they were now stuck together rather than, you know, being glad? Relieved, even? Wasn't the reason X-2 even happened was because of Yuna's desire to find Tidus? Why is she suddenly being so tsundere? There's a difference between playful teasing and just being cold.  :-\

It's sad because this ending, coupled with Will's events, just gives me the impression that Tidus was just being led on and in denial of their failing relationship all this time. Which is why he seemed uncharacteristically depressed and soft-spoken in Will. You know what, maybe Obscur's 'corruption' theory is right, only Yuna's feelings were 'sealed away' by Ifarnal and then corrupted/influenced by Bria and Kush' underwhelming reunion.

Really, what this seems like to me was Nojima was looking at Yoko Taro's work and then going, 'If he can make his stories as edgy as he wants, then so can I!" :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: kk on August 24, 2015, 04:09:51 pm
I agree: the ending was very abrupt. It just jumped around from place to place. It's like he was on a word count limit and had to shove all of the resolution into one chapter.

And it does seem like he's trying to imply that Yuna and Tidus were just puppy love and that, with these new challenges they're facing (his summoned state-- not to mention Yuna's apparent total 180 on her opinion of him), they're doomed.

Which, I mean... okay... if that's what he wants to believe, then fine. There's certainly something to be said about love, especially young love, fading.

But aside from the fact that's such a weird thing to write about in a follow up to a decade old series that is renowned partially because of the iconic relationship between those two characters... he had to not only ignore canon, but alter it to get that point across. Like, why are you so obsessed with bringing your cynical vision to life that you ignore stated facts from your own game? o_o This has been a truly bizarre read, surely you jest.

I'm trying to enjoy it or to take something positive from it, but it's... difficult. xD

Oh, well. Nojima can keep to his fanfics, and I will keep to mine. :p
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on August 24, 2015, 06:26:40 pm
In this case, I have a lot of bull to sort through in the Restoration. Believe in yourself, me. XD

Joking aside, I just want to prepare myself for the FFX-3, if not for the FFX-3 fic I plan to write someday. I was able to stomach a lot of things so far; except for that damn 'dead incarnate spirits can conceive with a living person.' I'm like, are you for realz, guys? Yuna's tsundere, OOC behavior's one thing; I can patch that up somehow, tone it down, something. Tidus being a poor hate child woobie, yeah, that's nothing new. But Bria having a kid? Uhhh, I think Nojima's retconning the crap out of pyrefly physics. We need Maechen up in here!

Oh my god, good stories can only stay good and consistent when you have a team of people, not a single artist or writer doing all the work. Because this is what we get when Nojima's green-lighted to write a novel for a possible, future game. :P Too much unjustified artistic licensing crossing into personal territory.

Er, sorry, I'm ranting at this point. It's just... as a fellow writer, what Nojima did was blasphemous to me.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on August 25, 2015, 06:59:46 am
I don't think it's impossible for Bria to have kids... since he's pretty much like an unsent. They are as tangible as the living, only with a more fragile state of existence that can change as soon as they find out about their condition. That is what makes them different from the unsent: the latter are aware of being unsent, while the former don't even know that they're already dead.

I've always had that feeling that Bria/Valm was not so into Kush... I don't know why, maybe because of the moment he died, he felt like she was getting on his nerves, never considered how she felt about him, that it was only about him and his becoming of an Aeon Core without thinking of the consequences. Kush never wanted that for him, for him to live an eternity between life and death.

I thought there would be more to the story than this. I didn't get so many things. :( Like why Ifahnal summoned the island. Was it because of Kush, and how it reminded him of her? I mean, it was a war site, so many people fought and died there, why would he want to revive such a moment? And I have to re-read it to deduce why he killed Tidus.. :( Oh god. I feel so blind.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on August 25, 2015, 05:42:53 pm
I thought there would be more to the story than this. I didn't get so many things. :( Like why Ifahnal summoned the island. Was it because of Kush, and how it reminded him of her? I mean, it was a war site, so many people fought and died there, why would he want to revive such a moment? And I have to re-read it to deduce why he killed Tidus.. :( Oh god. I feel so blind.

I think you're right about Ifahnal and the existence of the island. I can't see anything else.

About Tidus, I'll tell you everything tomorrow, since my article, on a french website, dealing with that point, will be released tomorrow. So don't worry ! :)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on August 26, 2015, 01:21:40 pm
Okay, now let's talk about Tidus' death.

Tidus was killed by a bomb which looked like a blitzball. This ball hurt the back of his neck and then fell on the ground. Now, let me tell you what happened before that. It's simple : the mecanical Bedohl living on the island put down a ball on the ground somewhere around them and kick it so that it hurt Tidus. And Johit ordered it to do that. How can I be so sure ? Well, let's take a look at the end of the novel... when Bria appeared on Ifahnal's ship. At that time, the mecanical Bedohl appeared from the hold of the ship... holding a ball. Remember what Johit told it at that moment ? "Now, kill the Guard!" I think you can understand everything now.

Now let's return to the beginning of this little story between Ifahnal and Yuna/Tidus. I'll get straight to the point.

When Tidus and Yuna were on their ship, this one suddenly exploded. The reason behind that is Ifahnal. He summoned bombs/balls to blow it to smithereens. How can I be sure ? Well, if you remember, Tidus smelt gunpowder at that time... as Valm did in the past before fainting because of the bomb (take a look at the third chapter). Then, Ifahnal let them in the middle of the sea, surrounded by monsters. In fact, he was testing them at that time. He was testing their love, their will, or anything related. He wanted to know if Yuna could revive Tidus thanks to her will, and to do it, their relation had to be strong. And finally, when he was convinced, he took them to his island.

On the island, he probably had to wait for them to come close to the base so that the mecanical Bedohl take them inside and take care of them. Ifahnal did that so that Tidus and Yuna think that the mecanical Bedohl is definitely an ally. He had to prevent them from suspecting the Bedohl. Yes, Ifahnal is a scheming man. And he helped Yuna to revive Tidus so that they think he's an ally too.

You know what happens next.

But I don't think he's a bad person. It's just that he wanted to end Kush's and Valm's story. A thousand years as an unsent is quite special, you know.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on August 26, 2015, 02:20:48 pm
That much I got alright, what I didn't get was why he was so keen for Yuna to beckon Tidus, even going to the extreme of killing him so it would be possible for her to do it. It just... doesn't fit. :/ It's pretty much like the reason for summoning the island at all.

I think Johit is a really sad man. He said that he wished he had died much earlier (perhaps during that battle?), that he regrets being so vain in his youth (he really looks like Bickson in my mind, that jerk from the Luca Goers) and his unrequited love for Kush. Maybe he had no other purpose than to summon, after his expulsion from Besaid when the Church built the temple there... pretty much like Yu Yevon, the very man he had fought against during the war. At the same time as he felt jealous of Kush and Valm/Bria, he'd erase the latter's memories about the former maybe in an effort to protect his existence, since that was what Kush would have wanted: to set Bria free from her and the war. He had a whole future ahead of him and only death awaited her. She chose to get out of the picture so he would leave, but that didn't work out and the "mechanical" Bedohl killed him.

Speaking of mechanical Bedohls, are they really a thing? Because the ones we saw in the story were actually true, human, only that Alb might have done some magic or brainwashing in them so they'd act "robotic". In my mind, they look like this (http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20140410183438/finalfantasy/images/a/a4/Al_Bhed_Kid.jpg), which is actually an Al Bhed kid. It's said that Alb had never managed to create artificial Bedohls. This should mean that the "mechanical" Bedohl we see is either a summoned one or an unsent that has been brainwashed.

As for the Aeon Cores, Ifahnal brought up a topic that's worth attention. The limitation imposed by Yevon on the post-war summoners have severely diminished their potential power. The knowledge of creating fayth has been concentrated into Yunalesca's hand and any other methods may have been forbidden by the teachings. If, say, Ifahnal had passed down his knowledge, he'd surely be executed and sent, and that was the last thing he wanted. The utility of summoners had been reduced to "defeating" Sin (that's what people wanted to believe in) and perpetuating the cycle whilst injecting false hope in people. Forcing summoners to use whatever fayth available to them and deny them the knowledge of creating their own aeons severely diminished their power. The Aeon Core was akin to the Final Aeon Yunalesca created - it was an impressive creature born from a fayth who shared a close bond with its summoner. Imagine if anyone could harness such power - the Church would be powerless. It could be said that the Yevon era was, indeed, a Dark Age.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on August 26, 2015, 04:04:29 pm
Thanks so much, ChercheurObscur! That's nice to know you've picked up all the pieces and tried to put together some semblance of a coherent picture. I'll definitely come back to refer to this later when I reach those parts in the Restoration.  ;)

The only way I can really justify Johit's actions as this point is broken humanity. He was obviously struggling to hold onto it, but after becoming an Unsent at such an old age, obviously clinging to whatever he could in such a dismal situation... no wonder his process for ending that particular cycle confused us all. It's the only thing that made sense to him, involving two innocent people to end a horrible tragedy.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on September 03, 2015, 02:34:03 am
Now that I think of it, the novella justifies Yuna's attitude in the audio drama (her going back to her old ways etc). Remember what Auron said at the bottom of Macalania Lake? That it was not Yevon, the temples or the teachings that gave summoners power, but the fayth. Yuna had recently seen proof that the art of summoning was not obsolete, that there were ways other than what Yevon's teachings taught her to believe in.

Given that she found out that she still is a summoner, that she never ceased to be one just because Yevon's fayth vanished, and that she now had the knowledge of creating Aeon Cores (that most certainly does not involve sex (at least where intercourse in itself is concerned), lest poor Bedohl males Johit turned into Cores), she could be trying to reach a state of mind in that she could be able to do just that, under the guise of "praying to the fayth". Doing that, not only does she sharpen her somewhat dampened summoning skills that she had not practiced for 2 years, but keeps encouraging the Besaid elders' faith.

Just my two cents on the matter. :)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: sarahlyf on September 03, 2015, 11:02:14 am
I have just listened to the 'Bonus Audio' an hour ago ...which turned my world upside down

Oh dear God..... what have I gotten myself into...
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on September 03, 2015, 11:03:55 am
I have just listened to the 'Bonus Audio' an hour ago ...which turned my world upside down

Oh dear God..... what have I gotten myself into...

Welcome to a whole new world of insanity.

You'll never go back to the fanbase again. :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on September 03, 2015, 11:58:18 am
Now that I think of it, the novella justifies Yuna's attitude in the audio drama (her going back to her old ways etc). Remember what Auron said at the bottom of Macalania Lake? That it was not Yevon, the temples or the teachings that gave summoners power, but the fayth. Yuna had recently seen proof that the art of summoning was not obsolete, that there were ways other than what Yevon's teachings taught her to believe in.

Given that she found out that she still is a summoner, that she never ceased to be one just because Yevon's fayth vanished, and that she now had the knowledge of creating Aeon Cores (that most certainly does not involve sex (at least where intercourse in itself is concerned), lest poor Bedohl males Johit turned into Cores), she could be trying to reach a state of mind in that she could be able to do just that, under the guise of "praying to the fayth". Doing that, not only does she sharpen her somewhat dampened summoning skills that she had not practiced for 2 years, but keeps encouraging the Besaid elders' faith.

Just my two cents on the matter. :)

Which makes me wonder if Yuna confided in anyone of the events in The Price of Eternity and to what extent. Sure, she mentioned using the Final Aeon in Will, but I doubt Lulu or Wakka, or even Tidus is aware she received the knowledge to make Aeon Cores, let alone are remotely aware of the fact Tidus is beckoned. (Damn, how many secrets is this woman hoarding?) I also speculate that Yuna may turn to Baralai alone with this information, because he's in the position to help her find possible old Aeons around the world, and that he would keep it secret as a political decision not to rouse the Yevoner hunters into action or prevent inevitable discontent among the people.

There are many possibilities for FFX-3, such as discovering the true nature of Sin, who the main antagonist may be (leader of the Yevoner hunters? Or whoever freakin beckoned Sin?), exploring the whole world to uncover more mysteries that the Dark Age of Yevon stifled, and Yuna coming to terms with her feelings once and for all. I do like kk's idea (from tumblr, hehe) that the best outcome for Tidus would be to turn him into a Fayth as the mighty LEVIATHAN, let's hear it folks! :D (Although I personally prefer if Tidus could finally rest in peace and chill in the Farplane. It's not good for the Tuna romance if Yuna's stuck romancing a Fayth. :P)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on September 03, 2015, 12:04:13 pm
I have just listened to the 'Bonus Audio' an hour ago ...which turned my world upside down

Oh dear God..... what have I gotten myself into...

Welcome to a whole new world of insanity.

You'll never go back to the fanbase again. :P

Yeah, sarahlyf. It gets better.  8)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on September 03, 2015, 12:23:46 pm
Now that I think of it, the novella justifies Yuna's attitude in the audio drama (her going back to her old ways etc). Remember what Auron said at the bottom of Macalania Lake? That it was not Yevon, the temples or the teachings that gave summoners power, but the fayth. Yuna had recently seen proof that the art of summoning was not obsolete, that there were ways other than what Yevon's teachings taught her to believe in.

Given that she found out that she still is a summoner, that she never ceased to be one just because Yevon's fayth vanished, and that she now had the knowledge of creating Aeon Cores (that most certainly does not involve sex (at least where intercourse in itself is concerned), lest poor Bedohl males Johit turned into Cores), she could be trying to reach a state of mind in that she could be able to do just that, under the guise of "praying to the fayth". Doing that, not only does she sharpen her somewhat dampened summoning skills that she had not practiced for 2 years, but keeps encouraging the Besaid elders' faith.

Just my two cents on the matter. :)


There are many possibilities for FFX-3, such as discovering the true nature of Sin, who the main antagonist may be (leader of the Yevoner hunters? Or whoever freakin beckoned Sin?), exploring the whole world to uncover more mysteries that the Dark Age of Yevon stifled, and Yuna coming to terms with her feelings once and for all. I do like kk's idea (from tumblr, hehe) that the best outcome for Tidus would be to turn him into a Fayth as the mighty LEVIATHAN, let's hear it folks! :D (Although I personally prefer if Tidus could finally rest in peace and chill in the Farplane. It's not good for the Tuna romance if Yuna's stuck romancing a Fayth. :P)

Of course! There was never a 'true' water-themed aeon that we ever hear of in the Spiran lore. It turns out that Tidus would be the chosen vessel for Leviathan: The 300-mile-long demon that would destroy and recreate the world anew! :P

But personally, I would like to see the fayth's 'true motives' explored if an X-3 ever comes out. I would think that a mass of people subjected to a world-changing war, then being enslaved by their city's leader and forced to conjure the memory of their destroyed city for a thousand years would end up with some of them being... not the nicest, shall we say. I would even go as far as to say that some of them spite Tidus for relying on their painful dreaming to stay alive (maybe his murder was planned in advance by one of the fayth so that it would look like someone else did it/an accident, so that they could finally end their dreaming. Of course, it didn't exactly work that way...)

It would be a very 'the grey place between black and white' story. Are the fayth selfish for what they did, or are they justified? Is it their fault that they were forced to create Dream Zanarkand, which by all means was an 'accident' of the Machina War? Is what happens to Tidus their fault, or Yuna's? Is there a fayth that is 'above' the rest of them?
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on September 03, 2015, 12:34:58 pm
Of course! There was never a 'true' water-themed aeon that we ever hear of in the Spiran lore. It turns out that Tidus would be the chosen vessel for Leviathan: The 300-mile-long demon that would destroy and recreate the world anew! :P

And if it's possible to turn incarnate spirits into Fayth, then maybe Seymour can become Odin! :D

Sorry, UltimaGriever, I piggy-backed from your brilliant idea. <3

Or Auron as a male Asura? please don't hate me

Edit: EVEN BETTER, Auron shall be the Pheonix!!!  :o
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on September 07, 2015, 10:06:14 am
Yo, I haven't been here since Tidus got his head blown off. Great job Chercher for finishing the translation! I have to ask though. Do you guys think it's a good idea to be posting Fan-Fiction right on top of the ACTUAL translation like that? I'm not trying to be rude!!! I'm just concerned that the legit book is going to end up buried under this stuff.  :)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on September 07, 2015, 06:39:01 pm
Of course! There was never a 'true' water-themed aeon that we ever hear of in the Spiran lore. It turns out that Tidus would be the chosen vessel for Leviathan: The 300-mile-long demon that would destroy and recreate the world anew! :P

And if it's possible to turn incarnate spirits into Fayth, then maybe Seymour can become Odin! :D

Sorry, UltimaGriever, I piggy-backed from your brilliant idea. <3

Or Auron as a male Asura? please don't hate me

Edit: EVEN BETTER, Auron shall be the Pheonix!!!  :o

Seymour is TOTALLY Odin <3

I think I'm gonna draw this, I wonder how I can convey it though...

Well, about Yuna and her tendency to keep **** from everyone else, it's perfectly foreseeable. After all, she did keep Jyscal's sphere from her guardians and proceeded to marry Seymour fully knowing about his being a murderer and his schemes, and, had that nun not found the sphere, they would probably find out about her plans right at the last minute.

This reminded me of the talk Tidus and Auron had about Yuna's decision to marry. He had said that she wanted to "negotiate" with him, but he never said what exactly. Later when I replayed the game, it occurred to me that the "negotiations" were actually regarding to Seymour being willing to become Yuna's FA... Just an idea.

The fayth of DZ were most likely brainwashed into becoming so. The novella states that Yu Yevon and Yunalesca used to brainwash their forces into being suicidal, whether they were men, women or children. It's not unlikely that they were forced to do this: even though it's required that the person undergoing the change must be willing to do so, they could be induced into it by magic or religious influence.

Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on September 08, 2015, 12:47:11 pm
Yo, I haven't been here since Tidus got his head blown off. Great job Chercher for finishing the translation! I have to ask though. Do you guys think it's a good idea to be posting Fan-Fiction right on top of the ACTUAL translation like that? I'm not trying to be rude!!! I'm just concerned that the legit book is going to end up buried under this stuff.  :)

Well, I've had a discussion with the author and as long as "fan-written" is visible in the title of the topic, I don't mind. It's not as if a lot of people ended up there everyday. But your concern is appreciated.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on September 08, 2015, 06:45:46 pm
Yo, I haven't been here since Tidus got his head blown off. Great job Chercher for finishing the translation! I have to ask though. Do you guys think it's a good idea to be posting Fan-Fiction right on top of the ACTUAL translation like that? I'm not trying to be rude!!! I'm just concerned that the legit book is going to end up buried under this stuff.  :)

Well, I've had a discussion with the author and as long as "fan-written" is visible in the title of the topic, I don't mind. It's not as if a lot of people ended up there everyday. But your concern is appreciated.

That is a legitimate concern, and I want to be clear about one thing. It's not so much a fanfiction as it is a restoration. I plan to retain as much of the original content as I can without deviating from its intended meaning. Sure, my work is unofficial, more so unofficial than ObscurChecheur's translations, since Square Enix never approved (or met the willingness of anyone to do so) its translation outside France and Japan, and I shouldn't really compare my work to ObscurChecheur's since they are two completely different projects of the same title (and I feel his project is way more legitimized and acceptable than mine), but I do feel a bit offended you would debase my decision to embark on such a project by calling it 'fanfiction' when it is not. Not completely, at any rate.

Aside from that, I am happy to know you a member of our community and are enjoying our threads of discussion. I know the novel leaves much to be desired, especially its questionable state of brand-new canon material, but I hope you enjoy reading along to my rewrite of it. :3 I plan to post it publicly outside of this forum once I finish it here, complete with final edits and a dedicated page of disclaimers and everybody involved here in this forum who worked on the novel's English translation (unless anyone here is adverse to the idea, please do let me know clearly and right away, don't pull any of your punches, honesty is the best policy).

The way I see myself in this Restoration Project, I am the main writer/author, yes, but I am not the only one. We are all writers, creative in our own ways -- let it be editing, translating, interpreting, or researching (and et cetera). We are a team, and I don't plan to take any ill-due, sole credit for it.

please tell me if I'm being too indulgent or self-righteous about this
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on September 08, 2015, 07:04:20 pm
Well, about Yuna and her tendency to keep **** from everyone else, it's perfectly foreseeable. After all, she did keep Jyscal's sphere from her guardians and proceeded to marry Seymour fully knowing about his being a murderer and his schemes, and, had that nun not found the sphere, they would probably find out about her plans right at the last minute.

This reminded me of the talk Tidus and Auron had about Yuna's decision to marry. He had said that she wanted to "negotiate" with him, but he never said what exactly. Later when I replayed the game, it occurred to me that the "negotiations" were actually regarding to Seymour being willing to become Yuna's FA... Just an idea.

You know what, I think a lot of fans underestimate Yuna's ability to angst. So many of us, even Square Enix, arrive at this assumption that Yuna's this young girl who loves to dream and chase after her one true love without falter, who's one selfish wish was to live a normal life, free of obligation, and have a future with this dazzling boy who rocked her world; yeah, I guess that's the positive way of looking at it. There's even two happy endings given to us to cement that impression into our minds. But honestly, I think a lot of people are afraid to put her in any miserable, tragic situation that they feel is the slightest bit unwarranted, because she's already been through too much in-game. Or at least, find themselves unwilling to or incapable of portraying her depression/angst/issues realistically and IC. Or are content with keeping her perfectly happy with Tidus, because how could there possibly be any more issues between after everything they endured?

Really, it's so saccharine, I get nauseous. I never considered Yuna a "pure" or "dark" character, just neutral. That right balance of hope and passion and melancholy that's stuck between the extreme, opposite spectrums of Tidus (bright, sunny, inquisitive, child-like soul) and Seymour (corrupt, cynical, tortured, lost soul). We see Yuna run towards the light, in FFX-2, and now we're seeing her fall into the dark, in FFX-3. I think the series really portrays her character development in such a flawed and fascinating light. Besides Tidus, I think Yuna can easily be a broken base in fandom.

Or is that my unpopular opinion cuz I don't believe in fairy-tale happy endings and I'm a nerd for realism?
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on September 09, 2015, 07:12:58 pm
Hey Danko! First of all, I didn't mean to offend you in any way, nor did I intend to use the term "fan-fiction" in a derogatory manor. I simply called it fan-fiction because to me, that's essentially what you're doing. You're taking the "official" (or whatever you want to call it) book and expanding upon it with your own interpretations and ideas of how events, narrative, characters, dialogue, etc... should play out. Once again, that's fan-fiction to me.. Or fan-expansion if that's more accurate. :)

The only reason I brought it up was to make sure that everyone was ok with where it was being posted and since Chercher doesn't care, then that's that! At this point, you can throw all of the characters into a Hunger Games arena, see who comes out on top, and call it a night for all I care. :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on September 09, 2015, 08:59:12 pm
It's really saddening, but I feel like I'm one of the very few who honestly likes the novel despite its glaring, resentful... flaws. XD I mean, there are plenty of things to hate and criticize, but... I feel like... Sigh. People say whatever they want, but by the end of the day: no one really cares about -Will- or The Price of Eternity and prefers it never existed. I feel alone in my optimism. Funny enough, the more I learn about it, discuss it, etc, the more I'm open-minded towards its canon, which is the exact opposite of everyone else who lost faith in it as more and more time passed. I guess I just feel alone in my optimism.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on September 09, 2015, 09:20:23 pm
Hey Danko! First of all, I didn't mean to offend you in any way, nor did I intend to use the term "fan-fiction" in a derogatory manor. I simply called it fan-fiction because to me, that's essentially what you're doing. You're taking the "official" (or whatever you want to call it) book and expanding upon it with your own interpretations and ideas of how events, narrative, characters, dialogue, etc... should play out. Once again, that's fan-fiction to me.. Or fan-expansion if that's more accurate. :)

I know you didn't mean to offend anyone at all, it's just... er, well, I got pretty defensive, because the main reason why I embarked on this project was to provide a better, if not tolerable version of a mediocre novel for those who do want to read it and are curious to know the details, but are scared of being disappointed or horrified. Anyway, I'm gonna stop now, because I sound like I'm whining at this point. XD
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: ChercheurObscur on September 10, 2015, 09:01:54 am
It's really saddening, but I feel like I'm one of the very few who honestly likes the novel despite its glaring, resentful... flaws. XD I mean, there are plenty of things to hate and criticize, but... I feel like... Sigh. People say whatever they want, but by the end of the day: no one really cares about -Will- or The Price of Eternity and prefers it never existed. I feel alone in my optimism. Funny enough, the more I learn about it, discuss it, etc, the more I'm open-minded towards its canon, which is the exact opposite of everyone else who lost faith in it as more and more time passed. I guess I just feel alone in my optimism.

What's really saddening is that a lot of people see no further than the end of their nose. A noteworthy passage is Tidus' death. People keep in mind his decapitated head, but few wonder from where comes the ball which killed him.

Nojima has dispersed hints to explain the truth, and I've already explained a part of this truth. Of course, I may be wrong but there are too many coincidences.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on September 10, 2015, 01:15:21 pm
I can see where the rest of the story could be heading, the bottom line is that having a main character's head randomly get blown off and land in his girlfriend's lap is comically cheesy. I was cracking up! How am I supposed to take that seriously? If I were you, I wouldn't be too upset about it all because I doubt Square Enix will consider this novel canon and if they do, I'm sure it will eventually be ret-conned, considered as an alternate time-line, or thrown out completely as non-canon. For the record, I didn't think the audio drama was that bad and I think it's something that they COULD work with.

Fiction does this all of the time. Look at Zelda, Star Wars, super hero franchises, or countless other works of fiction that constantly create alternate timelines, ret-con things, and in Star Wars case, dismiss countless works as non-canon.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on September 10, 2015, 01:32:54 pm
Fiction does this all of the time. Look at Zelda, Star Wars, or countless other works of fiction that constantly create alternate timelines or in Star Wars case, dismiss countless works as non-canon.

This is exactly what I was thinking about in regards to this new canon. We all know it's highly controversial. Heck, Square knows as well. Considering how much they twisted and turned XIII's lore, it won't surprise me if they eventually do come out and regard this as alternate universe. Nojima already considered it an 'expansion to the world,' as vague as that might be.

For example, they came out with the official timeline for the Zelda games, yeah? It starts with what I call the 'Master Canon,' that is Skyward Sword to Minish Cap to Four Swords to Ocarina of Time. However, when it gets to Ocarina of Time, that's when the timeline is split up into three different universes. (http://zeldawiki.org/images/thumb/7/7c/Timeline_Hyrule_Historia.jpg/350px-Timeline_Hyrule_Historia.jpg)

It wouldn't be entirely taboo to do something like this with such a versatile universe like Spira, right? A lot of animes like Evangelion and Clannad do this as well. You have the 'Master Canon' that is FFX and FFX-2, then after their events the timeline splits into two different universes. In one universe, Tidus and Yuna aren't entirely happy and 'accepted' upon returning to Besaid, hence the events of Price of Eternity and Will. On the other hand, he and his friends lead a much more enjoyable future which leads into a separate universe.

I know, Nojima's the Word of God and we should all treat his work like holy scriptures, but at least if I was intent on milking the universe of Spira VII Compilation-style without p*ssing off all of the fans, I would consider something like this. :P
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on September 10, 2015, 03:16:14 pm
That does bring to question the validity of the alternate endings for FFX-2. It's one thing to write them for the sake of fans who have their own preferences. That's kind of them, if not annoying, because that only led to fans arguing amongst themselves over what's canon like "a bloody bunch of headless chickens." :p

Joking aside, now I wonder if Nojima plans to piggy back on those alternate endings to create multiple universes. He already did it with FFXIII-2, inevitable considering it's time travel, but I don't see the point in giving players their choice of an ending when SE decided on a "True Ending" anyway and went off from that with FFXIII-3.

We've already been exploring the alternate endings through fanfiction, and there are a lot of them worth their mettle and creativity. What else can Nojima bring to the table that we haven't already imagined?
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on September 10, 2015, 03:25:46 pm
It wouldn't be entirely taboo to do something like this with such a versatile universe like Spira, right? A lot of animes like Evangelion and Clannad do this as well. You have the 'Master Canon' that is FFX and FFX-2, then after their events the timeline splits into two different universes. In one universe, Tidus and Yuna aren't entirely happy and 'accepted' upon returning to Besaid, hence the events of Price of Eternity and Will. On the other hand, he and his friends lead a much more enjoyable future which leads into a separate universe.

I know, Nojima's the Word of God and we should all treat his work like holy scriptures, but at least if I was intent on milking the universe of Spira VII Compilation-style without p*ssing off all of the fans, I would consider something like this. :P

If the events of Will and Price of Eternity are the result of the Good Ending, ultimately leading to the Perfect Ending, and that's what we consider the unhappy timeline for Tidus/Yuna, then what does that make the Sad/Normal/Bad Ending? Where Tidus never comes back? Does that mean the timeline where Yuna and friends are happier and in a much less messed up world is the Sad Ending? We know that with the Bad Ending, sure, everyone in the Farplane is alive, but everybody else on the surface are decimated, ruining the chance for FFVII to happen in canon. And then there's the Normal Ending, which to me is the only real ending, because that one never changes. No matter how you look at it, Tidus and Yuna were never meant to be. Which is really cruel, because apparently it wasn't enough hammering that bleak point home in FFX. They just gotta beat the dead horse until it's unrecognizable.  ::)
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on September 10, 2015, 04:33:19 pm
To demonstrate, I've made up my own little timeline. (http://imgur.com/a/aNdvQ) Apologies if you can't read my handwriting, but you see what I'm getting at, right? :P



and no, the ff7 connection doesnt exist, it's all in the mind
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on September 10, 2015, 04:33:26 pm
The only thing I care to wonder is if this novella would be better accepted if those faux translations didn't leak. Or that the events of a bloody war would be roses and flowers and pyreflies were fireworks.

The hypocrisy is glaring. Never mind the enlightenment to Spira's history this work provides us, it's all about real-world issues not being even remotely possible in a work of fiction for the sake of being fiction and it's even worse if that fiction's couple starts to disagree on how to act because it's the first time they can actually be honest with each other. Wow.

-Will- is canon, it has been provided by an official and legitimate source (FFX/X-2 HD Remaster Blu-Ray) and it references events from the novella, which was also provided by an official and legitimate source (Nojima), which makes it canon, too. I hated with all of my guts that FFVII is getting a remake because it's lame, but it's going to happen anyway and there's nothing that can be done about it. So yes, the audio tale is canon, the novella is canon, get over it. SE might not release FFX-3, but, if they do, they will most likely base themselves off the audio and the novella.

Star Wars EU books were written by licensed authors, they were basically licensed fanfiction, so it's understandable that Disney regarded them as non-canon because they didn't come from the original creator and they conflict on various points. But this novella was written by Nojima himself, the man who wrote the whole FFX history and created the characters, it's in his right to write whatever he wants and SE is in their right to consider it canon.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on September 10, 2015, 04:44:40 pm
To demonstrate, I've made up my own little timeline. (http://imgur.com/a/aNdvQ) Apologies if you can't read my handwriting, but you see what I'm getting at, right? :P

and no, the ff7 connection doesnt exist, it's all in the mind

OMG, your timeline is asjfgjhgfg luv ur little Sin, but anyway. Ahem. Hrm. You honestly think there's room for a split timeline from the Good/Perfect Ending? Because the Good/Perfect timeline goes like this:

FFX-2 --> Good End --> FFX-2.5 --> Last Mission (three months after Chap 33 of novel) --> THEN Perfect End (six months after novel events, apparently) --> THEN finally Will.

Where would the split happen? Humor me cuz I am legitimately curious
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on September 10, 2015, 04:58:00 pm
I agree with you, UltimaGriever. There's just not enough words to adequately describe the utter frustration we feel towards the astonishingly negative reception of FFX-2.5. I always imagined Yuna and Tidus would have those kind of arguments, based on their different priorities and values growing up. I liked it actually, because it revealed Yuna's true feelings about post-Sin Church and what she wants to do about it. I mean, really stop to think about this:

Yuna disassembled Vegnagun (with the help of her friends, again). She put Shuyin to rest. She saved a friend from the clutches of a psychopathic Unsent. Things were different this time around. She didn't have to lose friends in order to win. She saved them. Then she ran into Bahamut, who made a ridiculously vague offer disguised as a rhetorical question: "Do you want a moment to walk with him again?" /something to that effect, and she said yes because who wouldn't? Wishful thinking. Yuna bids goodbye to her new friends and decides to go home, leaving the Gullwings (without seriously considering she may actually seeing Tidus again). We know from Last Mission, that all she does is babysit Vidina and feel wistful watching her best friends be a happy, little family. In the three months since the game ended. And in the novel, her argument with Tidus heavily implied she had been planning to restore the idle clergy, or at least answer the old folk's concern.

Reuniting with Tidus had more repercussions than we thought, because that changes Yuna's priorities entirely.

I think we've severely underestimated the internal conflicts Yuna struggles with. Yuna's the type of character whose wants and needs are always in conflict, ever since FFX. Not downplaying the importance of Tidus/Yuna or anything, but I'm thinking about Yuna as an individual and how her world keeps constantly changing, for better or for worse. Yuna post-FFX-2 has such fascinating, potential issues that are never seen in plain sight, but they're always there, just bubbling beneath the surface of her smile.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on September 10, 2015, 06:46:48 pm
Ultimate G, you're forgetting something!! The scene in FFX-2 Last mission that coincides with the "perfect" ending in FFX-2 has already been retconned!! They completely threw the whole thing out! It was the original ending to the same scene that this book starts out in. This book is retcon of that scene!  :D :D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on September 10, 2015, 07:45:27 pm
Oh, yeah... I forgot about that. It's true, huh? XD

Whelp, I guess they don't care when it comes to retconning happy scenes into bittersweet, depressing ones.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: UltimaGriever on September 10, 2015, 07:55:56 pm
I couldn't really imagine it being that happy for them either way. It's not that Yuna outgrew Tidus, just that they'd meet a lot of resistance from the elders (who wanted her to settle down and get married to someone respectable) and problems would arise eventually, because Tidus doesn't respect Yevon and authority in general while Yuna does.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on September 10, 2015, 08:15:27 pm
Personally, I just find this novel completely unnecessary and I honestly believe it will be disregarded. There's no reason why they can't just start from the audio drama and flesh out a story.... which is what I thought they were going to do. The overreactions towards the drama were incredibly short-sighted, considering the fact that it was clear that Sin's return was a side-effect of a larger problem, not just "SINZ BACK GUYZZZ" . It's also completely normal for Tidus & Yuna to have relationship problems and was made obvious that Yuna broke it off in order to be the world's savior again... (which I bet a plot twist in the first 30 minutes of X-3 would've made that irellivant).

All of that being said, there's no salvaging this novel to me and I think there's a reason it wasn't made widely available, whereas the audio drama was put onto every release of the HD collection - complete with voice acting. I honestly think the novel was written for the heck of it and shouldn't be taken seriously... not sure why some seem to take it as the word of god. Even its ending makes it pretty obvious that it was quickly thrown together.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on September 11, 2015, 10:37:07 am
Guys, guys. Now this is just my opinion, but we have to remember that not all of the FFX community are die-hard fans (I used to be one but now I've mostly turned to AUs and concept designs). Games aren't the niche, 'nerdy' things that they used to be 15~ years ago; now they're a hobby to lots of people from hardc*re to casual. Remember that for in order for something to succeed, they need to appeal to the widest audience. Not all of the fans want to be bludgeoned with overly-complicated and deep themes. Nor do all of them want to read an entire novel just to get a vague understanding of another 30-minute long drama with no visual stimuli. Leave that to the medium that people can choose to adapt as headcanon. Like fanfiction. M'jai's fanfictions for example; should we just disregard and force everyone to write off absolutely everything in the Spira's Dream series just because it isn't canon?

Yes, Nojima expressed that he would like to see an X-3. But he writes scenarios. He can tell a story about how Tidus and Yuna become heavy drug addicts and how Yevon forces everyone in Spira to do the Macarena for five hours every day, but if it's disapproved and rejected by Square, it's not happening. Square owns the rights to FFX and ultimately decides what happens with it. It's up to the higher powers to decide if an X-3 would be a good idea or not. And you all know how divided the FF community gets when anything is announced, especially for older games. Sad but true.

I think we should keep this speculation light-hearted, free of tension and not point any bitter fingers to the rest of the fanbase. It's not good to be a hipster who jeers at any of the filthy casuals, even if we did just translate an entire novella that a good portion of the fanbase doesn't even know exists. :P

Now if you'll excuse me, I'm off to plan a fanfiction for the Bad Ending timeline. :D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on September 11, 2015, 11:09:53 am
haha I'm that casual fan Crystal. Gaming's one of my favorite hobbies but I've never taken any of it seriously, like gotten into fandoms, read fan-fiction, or whatever...I'm not even sure how all of that works.. :P I just do it all for fun. Hearing the bonus audio drama at the end was enough for me to get excited for X-3. I randomly heard that there was a novel where Tidus gets his head blown off, googled it out of curiosity, and came here to find this site. That's why I think this novel wasn't meant to go anywhere or be anything more than just something to throw out there. It just isn't accessible enough if that makes sense.

Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on September 11, 2015, 11:29:52 am
Exactly. Don't you find it strange that in close to two years since its release, Square issued a Japanese and French release for the novel but not an English one? This may just be country bias, but I'm sure that the most-used language in the FF community, alongside Japanese, is English. Why make it inaccessible to a majority of English fans, then? It makes me think that Square didn't think the novella was entirely a good idea, but didn't want to disrespect Nojima in that regard.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: mamboitaliano on September 11, 2015, 11:42:50 am
That's my point. I'm not sure which, but English speakers are either the largest or 2nd (to Japan) largest consumers of Final Fantasy. So the book's lack of availability to us is not a coincidence imo. The audio drama's wide availability led me to believe that if they do something, they'll piggy-back off of it and probably ignore the novel. No disrespect to Nojima. It's just business.

Btw, I'd totally play that game. The drugs get them through the Macerana. :D
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: CrystalOfLies on September 11, 2015, 12:41:51 pm
I just realised: If Chuami really is telling the truth about being Auron's daughter... she's technically the only living relative Tidus has left if Auron had filled out adoption forms.

His only family is his adopted stepsister. Such tragedy. Many angst.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: behindthewheel on September 26, 2015, 09:16:29 am
Hi everyone!
I know this is all old news by now but I've been out of the loop for quite some time.
Had a flash of nostalgia a few weeks back and googled for some FFX related stuff and one of the first suggestions are "Tidus Yuna break up", so of course I had to look in to this further and found this site.
Been lurking a few weeks reading the novel and listening to Will.
Massive amount of work done here with the translation, thank you very much for all of it!

I kind of have to side with those not too fond of the novel. A lot of it having to do that I am a huge sap XD
But I also have a realistic side and I could've taken T & Y growing apart in time but killing him like right after she gets him back is just rude.
I also find it interesting that he is seems weak already before he dies, and is really bad at blitzball all of a sudden, and then in Will he is a star again, even though he is weak still and seems sick (well dead). I'm not sure how they put those pieces together.
I also have such a hard time coming to terms with Yuna going back with Yevon, after all she knows and went through. Even if it is for the elders or finding out more about her summoner powers, there must be another way than re-joining the church who kept everyone in the dark for 1000 years.
Yuna acts so strangely in Will, even more stiff than in FFX, that I'm wondering if she is possessed.
She also says that the final aeon is the only way to beat Sin, which we all know isn't true. Why would she of all people claim that?
And that Kurgum(spelling?) all of a sudden proclaims his love for Yuna, someone he just met, makes me think more of the possession-theory.

I read now in the end the post about Ifahnal killing Tidus and the reasons why, but I still don't see why he would have to die for Ifahnal to use him and Yuna for his purposes. It just remains a gimmick -_-

However it is quite exciting who would beckon Sin, and some of the other parts of the stories, I feel that it is quite cliffhanger-y but at the same time the ending of a new game would be either similar to X or X-2, it would be very much of a repetition, I think.
Sorry for the long post but I just really needed to get some of the stuff out.
Have been rageing for weeks about my OTP and all but this didn't turn out to screaming haha
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Izunia on December 24, 2016, 07:05:39 pm
If I shout here, will I hear my own echo?
Seems like this board isn't very active since September 2015. What happened here? For me, the board seemed very active. Or are you moved to a new host?


Well, anyway, there is a chance this here won't read anyone. I just registered to send you my best regards for the translation. I currently read your translation and I actually enjoying it, the translation, and the story (surprise). Of course, as somebody who own a Blog about Literature with a focus on translations, I will always prefer a translation direct from the source of the original language the book was written in. I'm from Germany, this is also my native language and most translations from the japanese here are coming direct from the japanese version, unfortunately, there are still publishers who are translating from english source. And I'm not the biggest fan of official english translations, cause most of them are translated pretty liberal.

Reading your translation from French to English is, however, pretty fluid, not over the top and it's a pretty quick read so far. I really envy you because, we most likely never see an official english or german translation. I spotted the french translation on Amazon, I was happy till the moment the description told me this is French, and the last time I had something to do with french was in 7th grade, gosh, feels like an eternity, I'm turning 30 next month.

I was really curious to read X-2.5. I never played through X-2 but I have quite the overview of the story, plus, there is a summary in X-2.5. For over 2 years now, I'm looking for a fan translation, but never found one. I thought, it can't be so hard to find something like that because the Novel is quite short. Your translation is finished since last year if I see correctly. It took me a lot of different search queries and pages via Google to find this board here. I almost gave up and it was absolutely random that I have found you. And it really seems like people were deeply turned off by X-2.5, maybe because of many false information that were spread by emotional people who actually learned a little japanese through Karaoke Clips.

Since I'm away pretty often I created a PDF and sent it to my Kindle, of course not without to give you guys credits. But since I'm the only one reading this, this wasn't even necessary, but I still felt it was the right thing to do, even if only I read this PDF.

My post is coming to an end. Thanks for your effort and the translation. Nice holidays and a fine ride in the year 2017. I would love to see this board blooming again, count me in for contributing to fill the now empty halls with content.


Best regards,
Chancellor Izunia
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on December 24, 2016, 10:25:41 pm
Hello~ [echo echo echo...]

Nah, we didn't move to a new host. Or at least, I don't believe so. Many of us have trickled away and moved on to other sites, such as Tumblr and stuff. My reason, I've always meant to return, but life got in the way, and my personal lack of motivation for anything (that's really on me, tho), but behind the scenes I have been re-reading those translated chapters and slowly been rewriting them.

It's definitely nice to see you've liked the novel, at least! Or making the best out of a crappy situation. XD

Thank you so much for swinging by! I really ought to do the same. I would love for this place to bloom again, but who knows, right? :3

Merry Christmas and happy holidays!
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Ryurien on January 04, 2017, 10:54:37 am
I discovered this topic and only now and, because I'm a Italian with a basic knowledge of English, I was curious to ask a few questions to those who knows, now, more about this novel that I would try to read in the next few days.
Because I've heard crazy things about this story, I wanted to know if finally it was confirmed the beheading of Tidus after kicking a bomb (It seems too absurd!  ???), and the whole question of sex behind the ritual of the pilgrimage etc. or if all of this things are only hoaxes invented because of the non-translation of the novel (I hope it...).

Thank you!
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on January 04, 2017, 09:46:09 pm
Welcome, Ryurien!

So, first thing's first: Tidus's head did get blown off, but not because he shouted "blitzball!" like an idiot and kicked it (because how the hell does one get their head blown off kicking a bomb? I'm like, seriously?! Shouldn't his body starting from the feet and legs, be obliterated instead?). A bomb that was disguised as a blitzball was 'mysteriously' thrown in his direction, catching his attention. He then proceeded to walk over to pick it up and inspect it, since why would Tidus have any reason to suspect it's a leftover weapon from a thousand years ago, and then BOOM! His head flies off. If you read the novel in its entirety, you'll get the convoluted gist.

As for the plot device that is Deus Sex Machina (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/DeusSexMachina (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/DeusSexMachina)), I can't really tell you for sure 100% its legitimacy. Since I have yet to reach those chapters in my Fan Restoration Project (feel free to read that side-by-side with the original chapters) to analyze it thoroughly, I believe that the Bevellian Summoners' method of producing a "living Fayth" through an Aeon Core is a nod to an ancient spiritual Eastern practice called "Tantric sex," which is thought to expand consciousness and join together the polarities of masculine and feminine energy into a whole.

A link to the aforementioned subject: http://www.mindbodygreen.com/0-23332/tantric-sex-101-what-it-is-how-to-do-it.html (http://www.mindbodygreen.com/0-23332/tantric-sex-101-what-it-is-how-to-do-it.html)

I could talk more about that and its examples within the novel, but I want you to reach the chapters first before I spoil it for you.

I hope this cleared up some questions? If you have more, you are more than welcome to ask!
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Izunia on January 11, 2017, 04:42:41 pm
@Danko Kaji

Thanks for the warm welcoming. I think I will check your restoration project when you have completed it. And please don't get me wrong here, I actually like your restoration, but the main problem is, you have done this with your own words. So what we have is a translation from a French translation of a japanese book into English, including your own version which will even differ more from the original. That's the only reason I'm a little divided here.

So, I reached Chapter 21 now and there is definitely no "Deus Sex Machina". There are still a few chapters left, but even when Tidus head is blown off, it is not described very graphic. There is, of course, a lot of Yuna Fanservice and a little Rikku Fanservice included.

I have to say, the more I read, the more confusing this story gets. And I simply don't have any clue what is going on in Chapter 21. I do think the story is heavily complicated and written in a complicated japanese. These were the complaints I've read from readers who have read the original japanese version.

But in Chapter 21, the Translation from you guys isn't very good. There are Typos and you can read in every line, you had problems to translate the text. In one line, Bria is male, in the next line, you call him "Her", which clearly isn't the case here, because he is a dude. The most complicated chapters are the ones with Kush and Valm. The chapters with Tidus and Yuna are more accessible till the moment when Tidus head get's blown away.

Currently, the story is a really big mess and the translation is not on point anymore. There are still 13 chapters left, I sure hope there will be a little conclusion at the end.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on January 11, 2017, 04:58:30 pm
And please don't get me wrong here, I actually like your restoration, but the main problem is, you have done this with your own words. So what we have is a translation from a French translation of a japanese book into English, including your own version which will even differ more from the original. That's the only reason I'm a little divided here.

Wow, you don't mince words, do you? XD

Honestly, I am well aware of the fact my restoration will never be like the "official" novel, and that point did cause me to drop the ball on this... Many fans are rejecting this form of media as canon, and frankly, I believe my restoration is unwanted and unnecessary. However, it is a FAN Restoration. I'm embarking on it for myself, to better swallow and digest this story as canon, because I want to. I am canon trash, after all. I don't want to run away from it. I want to understand why Nojima decided to go for this sordid horror love story. If I were someone who was reading the restoration, not writing it, I would like to see it; I'm sure there are others who feel that way.

But yes, when I do publish it after I complete it, I will heavily emphasize and I mean heavily drive the point home it's a fan restoration, not a fanfic or a AU divergence. I will include everyone who participated in it, the translators, the editors, everyone. I will not take credit where credit is not mine. I simply want this (my interpretation) to be accessible, even if many haters and skeptics alike point out it's not the official product. I just want to share it.

I see the novel as like a skeleton, and my restoration is the meat and flesh on top of it. I'm doing my best not to outwardly change anything; the most I'm doing is rewriting dialogue and scenes to make more sense, or flow better. There was an actual line I included in Chapter 1 that wasn't in the novel, from Lulu... I plan to remove it, because it wasn't meant to be there. Otherwise, the chapters you see me post here are not finalized by any means. Think of it as a raw copy, or a second draft. I do plan to go over them again at a later time.

Now, moving on from that...

On the subject of the "Deus Sex Machina," I honestly don't know what to tell you. I'm not entirely convinced that Bevellian Summoners commit explicit sex, only that they form the bond through intimacy. It's infuriatingly vague about it; I dread to imagine how I'm going to interpret that part. But yes, the flow is okay to a point, and then everything in story quality goes downhill. Very confusing, very... lacking. But at the same time, because it has been translated twice through, I agree with you that the novel was written in complicated Japanese, on top of being a complicated story.

Yeah, I noticed the typos and such, too; I wasn't in charge of that process. XD But my friend did the best she could! They both did, translator and editor, especially when motivation was greatly lacking. I'm grateful we have an English translation at all. It beats having nothing.

Harsh critic! XD But you do have good points. I'm curious to see what you think of the ending.

Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: MacLarensPub on January 12, 2017, 05:50:50 pm
So I have stumbled across this forum after going through a rabbit hole, and I've reached the point where I need to start asking questions.

First, the French to English translation, is there an ebook format for it anywhere? Epub, Mobi, PDF? Can I find it uploaded to any sites like FanFiction.net?

Second, regarding the Rebirth Fan Restoration project: what is the aim of this project? A polish of the story, or a tweak to make it more fan-accepted? Also, does this project plan to have an ebook format (I'm an avid Kindle user), and are there plans to upload to FanFiction.net?

I'm very interested in reading these stories, but reading on a browser is very hard on the eyes.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: Danko Kaji on January 12, 2017, 06:18:52 pm
The French to English translation is not available as an ebook, (but you're more than welcome to compile it as an ebook yourself; I know another user did). And it's not uploaded on any other sites such as AO3 and FF.Net.

As for my aim of the Fan Restoration Project: yes, it is both a polish of the story, and at certain parts a tweak (such as exploring unanswered/vague plot points or details) to allow fans to at least tolerate it. At least, that's what I would want from such a thing, thinking as a fan. Now that you mention an ebook format, yes! Why not? I wouldn't mind it as an ebook at all! But I'm horribly versed in the realm of ebook, so if I can't figure it out, I might ask someone who does know how to do it for me. I do definitely plan to upload it on FF.Net and AO3 for public viewing and fan discussion. My main motivating factor for sharing it is so that everyone can have access to this story (without needing to go through a rabbit hole, to quote you.)

I feel you. Plus, it's harder on organization and bookmarking, too.
Title: Re: Final Fantasy X-2.5 : The Truth
Post by: guest167 on September 20, 2018, 07:14:16 pm
Hey ya’ll! Not sure if anyone still visits this forum but nonetheless I joined. I’ve been a FFX/FFX-2 fan since my mid-teens (they were the first FF games that got me into the series!) and every now and then I still look up memorable cutscenes from either game or brush up on Spira lore. FFX’s storyline will always be my favorite in the series! I don’t play console games now, but I still try to keep updated on what’s new in the FF franchise.

I vaguely knew about the novel and audio drama when they came out a few years back but didn’t bother to look them up until now. To the people on this forum who bothered translating and restoring the FFX-2.5 novel from the French release into English, thank you! I was able to find this site on google and read all the chapters available, as well as some old commentaries and threads that are still here.

As for the novel...I thought that the best it offers is an expansion of Spira’s history and lore, particularly the time of the Machina War and what summoners/ the summoning arts were like before Yevon’s teachings took hold. I don’t care at all for the way Tidus’ and Yuna’s love story was treated (since the audio drama follows the novel, I don’t care much for it either). Was it always Nojima’s intent to keep these two as star-crossed lovers? Even after the perfect ending in FFX-2, these two can’t get a break can they.

I don’t like the idea of Tidus and Yuna breaking up as much as the next die-hard fan, but I don’t understand why Tidus had to die (arguably for a second time) in this novel and come back as an incarnate spirit. Why must Tidus only exist somewhere between physical reality and the Farplane? Yes, he had existed as a dream of the fayth and was destined to fade away once the Sin-cycle ended in FFX. It was a miracle he came back in FFX-2. I believe he returned to Yuna as a complete, human, and fully mortal person...only to be killed in a freak accident shortly after. Why can’t Tidus and Yuna be together and live their lives without the threat of Tidus fading away?

What do you think. Could Tidus and Yuna have a happy and relatively normal existence together as a couple (or friends) or must there always be something supernatural keeping them apart? If anyone who is a fan still comes here, I’d love to share more thoughts and ideas on this.

Also, has anyone mentioned how macabre were the ‘mechanical’ Bedohls in the novel? How horrifying. Nojima should leave Tidus and Yuna alone and give us more of the Spira from 1000 years ago. That’s far more interesting.

No sign of development for FFX-3 yet, but I’m ok with that. Especially if there were plans on building upon the audio drama or novel.